Author Topic: Storyline Adjustment  (Read 15621 times)

Offline Freeza-CII

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« Reply #25 on: November 28, 2007, 05:46:54 PM »
As it was said in the picture they took the resources from cities as in there buildings and such.

Plus the way i was told the second ship leaves right at the meteor is hitting the atmosphere.  The other only would have already spun up to speed and is at or is hauling ass away from Jupiter.  

Why would it head the same way.  I explained this eariler.  It would go to the closest star.  then the closest to that start and so on till it found some thing just like the Conestoga.  It gets to the New terra system.  finds a planet with plenty of O2 and other gases but infected with a microbe with evidence of a civilization.  Not habitable deemed by the savants.  So they Move on to the next closest start this being the one The voyager start out towards.

Even this leaves the Time gap.  Even if the ships were apart they wouldn't have been more then a couple a years away from each other in travel distance.
 

Offline Marukasu

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« Reply #26 on: November 28, 2007, 05:59:57 PM »
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As it was said in the picture they took the resources from cities as in there buildings and such.

Plus the way i was told the second ship leaves right at the meteor is hitting the atmosphere. The other only would have already spun up to speed and is at or is hauling ass away from Jupiter.

Why would it head the same way. I explained this eariler. It would go to the closest star. then the closest to that start and so on till it found some thing just like the Conestoga. It gets to the New terra system. finds a planet with plenty of O2 and other gases but infected with a microbe with evidence of a civilization. Not habitable deemed by the savants. So they Move on to the next closest start this being the one The voyager start out towards.

Even this leaves the Time gap. Even if the ships were apart they wouldn't have been more then a couple a years away from each other in travel distance.

So your saying that the time it takes for the first ship to get past Jupiter, was the same time that the entire New Terra habitation took?

Unless the second ship was substantially inferior?

Offline Arklon

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« Reply #27 on: November 28, 2007, 06:02:03 PM »
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Unless the second ship was substantially inferior?
If it was, it'd most likely run out of resources sooner than the Conestoga did and would have to land on some other barely suitable planet.

Offline Freeza-CII

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« Reply #28 on: November 28, 2007, 06:02:44 PM »
No I am saying the First ship had a good head start on them.  By the time the second ship was fueled up at Jupiter it was well on its way to the first star.  a head start.  But these ships take a while to get up to speed and that is where all that couple year separation stuff came from.
« Last Edit: November 28, 2007, 06:03:20 PM by Freeza-CII »

Offline Arklon

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« Reply #29 on: November 28, 2007, 06:04:13 PM »
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No I am saying the First ship had a good head start on them.  By the time the second ship was fueled up at Jupiter it was well on its way to the first star.  a head start.  But these ships take a while to get up to speed and that is where all that couple year separation stuff came from.
New Terra was colonized for decades before its colonists were forced to evacuate, so they'd have to be pretty damn far apart.
« Last Edit: November 28, 2007, 06:04:56 PM by Arklon »

Offline Marukasu

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« Reply #30 on: November 28, 2007, 06:08:37 PM »
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so they'd have to be pretty damn far apart.
:D  True



Yeah... So Freeza-CII basically saying there would be decades of time after the first ship leaves before the second ship leaves.
« Last Edit: November 28, 2007, 06:09:58 PM by Marukasu »

Offline Freeza-CII

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« Reply #31 on: November 28, 2007, 06:12:08 PM »
This is also why i said there is a problem with time gap between them.

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Even this leaves the Time gap. Even if the ships were apart they wouldn't have been more then a couple a years away from each other in travel distance.

2 or 3 years apart I know that is not enough time.  Its all leaning to the conclusion that there cant be another space ship unless it headed for a different star after fueling at Jupiter.

But then this leaves us at the other conclusion that the 2nd earth ship and the Voyager would have no chance of ever meeting in the galaxy.  The odds against that are way to damn large.  Both now prove that a second ship from earth story just wont work.
« Last Edit: November 28, 2007, 06:14:58 PM by Freeza-CII »

Offline Marukasu

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« Reply #32 on: November 28, 2007, 06:14:16 PM »
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2 or 3 years apart I know that is not enough time. Its all leaning to the conclusion that there cant be another space ship unless it headed for a different start after fueling at Jupiter.

Yes! Therefore the ships would probably NOT meet up each other.(modifying older posts is a bit anoying. Especialy when you add something that somebody says right after:heh: )

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Both now prove that a second ship from earth story just wont work.
:D  Yep! (thumbsup)  (thumbsup)  (thumbsup)  :D  (thumbsup)  (thumbsup)  (thumbsup)

 :blink:  
« Last Edit: November 28, 2007, 06:21:26 PM by Marukasu »

Offline Freeza-CII

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« Reply #33 on: November 28, 2007, 06:27:12 PM »
Now the question is How can genesis have a story.  Go back to earth a Lifeless planet with a f***ed up atmosphere due to the meteor releasing dust and gases trapped in rocks and such.  Water all vaporized due to the intense heat of the impact.  I dont think earth is a feasible target.  Mars or Venus would actually work.  And Yes i did say Venus there is a Wiki on teraforming venus.  That is if any one really want to go to the Sol system.

Or could the Story go one with the children of plymouth starting up with with the eden children. on a new planet starting the whole process over.  With out the blight.  And they would have to make new weapons since i believe they dont have any of the earth military Database on there ship (Voyager) Nor do they have any of the weapon tech from new terra.  I dont see a need to have the blight be a main trigger for any thing so no point to actually have it in the story line.  As well as the savants left on new terra.  There transmissions wouldnt reach them for a long long long damn time and the new terra savant have no idea where the new colonies will set up shop in the galaxy.  So there involvement is non existent.  So what are we left with.  Just a ship full of Eden and some Plymouth children.  

Offline Sirbomber

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« Reply #34 on: November 28, 2007, 08:31:53 PM »
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New Terra was colonized for decades before its colonists were forced to evacuate, so they'd have to be pretty damn far apart.
You're all forgetting to take into consideration the Time Bend Theory, which states that if you go in or anywhere near a plot hole, time becomes completely irrelevant. This would allow the second ship to have taken off a few hours after the Conestoga and arrive 2,000 years after it, and nobody on board would ever know (unless somebody told them about it).
"As usual, colonist opinion is split between those who think the plague is a good idea, and those who are dying from it." - Outpost Evening Star

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Offline Freeza-CII

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« Reply #35 on: November 28, 2007, 09:29:21 PM »
thats all nice and danny but its still bs

Offline Sirbomber

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« Reply #36 on: November 28, 2007, 10:00:54 PM »
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thats all nice and danny but its still bs
And the rest of the story isn't? Why are you all arguing over a piece of nonsense as if it were a logical story that was planned and had several stages of development before it was written and finalized?
"As usual, colonist opinion is split between those who think the plague is a good idea, and those who are dying from it." - Outpost Evening Star

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Offline Freeza-CII

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« Reply #37 on: November 28, 2007, 10:45:54 PM »
With the way i was going it would be a completely different story.  I know that upsets every one so much.

Offline Marukasu

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« Reply #38 on: November 29, 2007, 12:50:37 AM »
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With the way i was going it would be a completely different story. I know that upsets every one so much.
Different story with I hope different game mechanics. Making the new game an almost replica of the old game would be a spectacular display of a lack of creativity.

BUT we cannot make the game to foreign to the original games audience. So minor tweaks and alteration are okay.


Then again that IS just my opinion.

Offline Freeza-CII

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« Reply #39 on: November 29, 2007, 01:10:07 AM »
Damn you dont read all the posts.

Like I said If it is done the way I suggest Any new colony on what ever new world would basicly have to start over with there military tech.  As I beleive it wasnt in the Phoenix Voyagers database.  This Opens the door to new weapons not the Laser Maser stuff.  Im sure they would work there ways in there but It opens the door to have completely different weapons but it would still have a op2 feel as they would still have the majority of the research and they would also have all the buildings available after research.

Basicly the Children of New Terra would be fighting each other.  As it is human nature to seek conflict.  Eventually there would be factioning of the main group.  There are both Eden and Plymouth people here from new terra.  So you can see where this is going.  And it would basicly let us keep the names Eden and Plymouth.  

As for the weapons they would have to reflect the same feel of op2 but dont need to be the same weapons.  So all the starter weapons would be the weakest and fast.  The the weapons get progressively stronger but have slower rof.  The story is the center of all of the game when you look at it like this.  

The planet itself could actually be a Venus like planet.  
Terraforming venus wiki

Assuming we can use a newwer story rather then the story that has to many gaps or a story that just sync up in the time line.  And make it more of the Children of New terra.  This makes Genesis a even better name for this game as well.

Offline Marukasu

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« Reply #40 on: November 29, 2007, 01:19:10 AM »
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So all the starter weapons would be the weakest and fast.

I really don't get how you could possibly think a laser would be able to cool off faster than a Rpg could reload.

Then again thats assuming that laser is the starting weapon. :heh:  
« Last Edit: November 29, 2007, 01:20:38 AM by Marukasu »

Offline Freeza-CII

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« Reply #41 on: November 29, 2007, 01:30:45 AM »
It leaves possibilities open for weapons.  I would rather see a set of weapons like in op2.  Where they keep the same kinda feel of fast and weak to strong and slow.  To have that gradient effect.  I would not like to see super weapons be born of this.  Like defense lasers that shoot down incoming things and what not.

Clearly there is more to be thought up here.  Hopefully all of this will be review by the Genesis team.

Offline Marukasu

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« Reply #42 on: November 29, 2007, 03:59:36 PM »
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I would rather see a set of weapons like in op2.
Hmm...
What would you think about widening the tech tree?
Techs that don't seem to to need prior techs could be brought down.
But to counter balance the simplicity that would bring increase the number of required tech for the higher techs.

Offline Hidiot

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« Reply #43 on: November 30, 2007, 02:46:07 AM »
I'm not really familiar with the story for this OP3 and I don't really have the time to search for everything, I will ask something:

Won't the techs in OP3 be further developments of their techs when they left New Terra, plus new ones, depending on their need?

Since they already have things like University, Nursery, Medical Center,etc. building plans somewhere in their non-encrypted databases, unless something happens to that database, they already have the necessary techs.

So,basically, what I was trying to get to is: Wouldn't OP3's tech tree not contain much of anything from OP2's tech tree, unless the story dictates so?
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Offline DarekStar

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« Reply #44 on: November 30, 2007, 12:29:45 PM »
According to that wiki a Vinus-like planet would be infesably hard to convert for 1 and also i found this.

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Converting atmosphere
Venus's atmosphere could be converted into some other form in situ by reacting it with externally supplied elements.

A method proposed in 1961 by Carl Sagan involves the use of genetically engineered bacteria to fix carbon into organic forms.[5] Although this method is still commonly proposed in discussions of Venus terraforming, later discoveries showed it would not be successful. The production of organic molecules from carbon dioxide requires an input of hydrogen, which on Earth is taken from its abundant supply of water but which is nearly nonexistent on Venus. Since Venus lacks a magnetic field, the upper atmosphere is exposed to direct erosion by solar wind and has lost most of its original hydrogen to space.


Are sientists today REALY sugesting making a blight!?
-Darek

Caution this user refuses to spell check or even try and spell corectly unless posting a story.

so bare with him

Offline Marukasu

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« Reply #45 on: November 30, 2007, 01:15:10 PM »
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Are *scientists* today *REALLY* *suggesting* making a blight!?
*Spelling mistake*In your original one.
if you actually read the article you would have discovered that they are not(the said it would need hydrogen which Venus doesn't have allot of)

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Although this method is still commonly proposed in discussions of Venus terraforming, later discoveries showed it would not be successful.The production of organic molecules from carbon dioxide requires an input of hydrogen, which on Earth is taken from its abundant supply of water but which is nearly nonexistent on Venus.
« Last Edit: November 30, 2007, 01:17:45 PM by Marukasu »

Offline Sirbomber

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« Reply #46 on: November 30, 2007, 09:31:17 PM »
This kind of thing isn't "The Blight"... We have them on Earth.
The Blight is a genetically engineered super-microbe completely designed by the Eden scientists that would be impossible for modern scientists to produce with our current technology.
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Offline Freeza-CII

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« Reply #47 on: November 30, 2007, 10:33:20 PM »
Infesable but possible

Offline Combine Crusier

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« Reply #48 on: November 30, 2007, 10:44:03 PM »
OI!

Has it ever occured to anyone that the Conestoga could have left a vapor trail? Hello fusion drives require hydrogen which is a fuel and fuel tends to leave remenants! Not to be crude but perhaps the Conestoga was sent out to START the colony so that when the second starship arrived there would already be a colony operating The spacedock around New Terra would probably be intact so the second starship could dock there while it's feul sharks gathered hydrogen from the nearby gas giant. As for the time difference... who's to say that we wouldn't have a moon base? If they could travel to other stars surely they could have a moon base. Just that they'd have to get the heck out of dodge before they get bombarded by fragments of Vulcan's Hammer, better yet there was talk that the people on the Jupiter mining station decided to gather resources from the asteroid belt and convert the station into a starship.

Hey I don't know but if the second starship were to follow the Conestogas vapor trail, find New Terra uninhabitable and then follow the Voyagers Ion trail it would undoubtably increase the odds of them meeting.

I would make some major modifications to this idea to make it work but it is locked...
http://forum.outpostuniverse.net/index.php?showtopic=3613
If unlocked I would make the nessecary modifications for I understand that it has been decided that Eden leaves first. Really I'd try to match it with what you say.
« Last Edit: November 30, 2007, 10:50:04 PM by Combine Crusier »
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Offline Tramis

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« Reply #49 on: November 30, 2007, 11:20:46 PM »
Since everyone seems to enjoy pointing out a "plot hole" that was fixed a long time ago and it seems nobody else in the team saw fit to mention it.  I've just been lurking mostly, but I finally decided to pop in long enough to clear this up (and hopefully increase the amount of helpful comments we get in here):

Cythera is in the same system as New Terra (probably the next planet over).  The Conestoga, though advanced, wasn't so much limited by available resources - after all, they had an entire, resource-rich planet at their disposal, not a barren rock like New Terra.

Then, while the Conestoga is in orbit around the hydrogen mine at Jupiter (as per Outpost 1), they put their 2 contingency plans into effect.  First, they launch a nuclear warhead at the asteroid, attempting to divert it.  This fails, instead breaking it into 2.  They quickly cobble together a second starship, thinking that its chances of survival are basically nil but they may as well try.

They launch the Frontier at the same time as the Conestoga leaves Jupiter.  This is where the plot hole is filled in - the nuke they launched not only broke apart the asteroid, but also released a massive EMP wave (which would normally not travel TOO far, but in space there is less particles in the way to block it and it travels for quite a ways) which scrambled the Frontier's navigation and comm systems.

Unable to plot a course or communicate with the Conestoga or Earth, the Frontier Savants simply decide to follow Conestoga and land wherever they land.  This gets scrapped when they reach New Terra's system.  The Frontier is caught on the fringe of a cloud of space debris (the same cloud that causes the meteor showers on New Terra) and loses track of the Conestoga, and they decide to land on Cythera, seeing that the meteor storm is inbound and will probably cause great difficulties to survival on NT.

Several years passed, and the Phoenix Voyager was launched from New Terra, intending to go to another system.  The rushed starship program however resulted in a problem with the ion drive module, which they needed for a long range space voyage.  They are forced to land somewhere closer, and decide on Cythera.

Hope that clears things up for you guys!

P.S. OP3 IS NOT DEAD!!!!!  we're working on recruiting more people to help us with programming (anyone who's willing to lend a hand instead of demanding we give it up would be most appreciated).  This project isn't dead, and it might take awhile, but IT WILL GET DONE.  Not a one of us is going to admit defeat, now or ever. [/finality]