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Outpost 2 Divided Destiny / Re: Military Strategies
« Last post by TechCor on April 25, 2019, 11:57:28 PM »
I don't appreciate this...  and you could at least spell my name right if you're going to say things like that.
Sorry about that. I meant it in jest. I guess it would have helped if I linked what I was reading.

Also, this wonderful gem, is so funny that not sharing was a crime worse than capitalizing the "b" in your name (IMO, of course).


As I suggested to Crow when he started work on his rebalance mod, if you want to do something like this, you should probably get some firsthand multiplayer experience.
I suppose getting my ass handed to me a few dozen times would teach me something, but there is a bit of a difference in this case. Mastering APMs and optimizing real-time decision making is something a human has to get good at. Bots, OTOH, can multitask and react better than any human. The difficulty is going to be having the AI adapt to changing conditions.

At Crow's suggestion, I looked a bit more and managed to find Leviathan's stash. I think studying some videos for build orders and unit tactics is going to work out much better. I can play against the AI until I can't beat it due to its superior reaction times, then I can play it against other people to discover its flaws and "train it". It'll be a lot of work, but a lot less than trying to become an Outpost 2 master. I'm not really interested in PvP personally, so no point going that route.

Whether it can compete with pro players is somewhat of a side goal. Currently, I would be happy if it could pick up from any starting condition, survive, build, and attack successfully with virtually no setup by a mission designer. The idea would be that if the AI isn't good enough, just give it more starting resources. Most players will figure out a bot's weaknesses and exploit them eventually anyway.
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Outpost 2 Divided Destiny / Re: Military Strategies
« Last post by Sirbomber on April 25, 2019, 10:26:02 PM »
That led to me looking it up, and discovering Sirbomber ranting complaining that Eden sucks.
I don't appreciate this...  and you could at least spell my name right if you're going to say things like that.

As I suggested to Crow when he started work on his rebalance mod, if you want to do something like this, you should probably get some firsthand multiplayer experience.
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Outpost 2 Divided Destiny / Re: Military Strategies
« Last post by Crow! on April 25, 2019, 06:53:05 AM »
You can find one series of 1v1 matches on Pie Chart from a while ago if you look on youtube.

To my knowledge and recollection, the early game is generally defined by the Stickyfoam weapon, which ensures that vehicle losses are minimal, but which can kill any struture with impunity if given enough time.  The midgame is defined by the ESG and its ability to encourage poking, since its effective range against an enemy that isn't paying attention is 9, but it does poorly when chasing into an opponent who is also using ESGs.  The late game is defined by the EMP missile and its ability to break stalemates.  High speed units like supernova lynxes and spiders suddenly gain some extra relevance, but having a tiger backbone to the army is also needed or else you lose any fights where EMP missiles didn't exactly hit their mark.

Eden's window of relevance is extremely narrow.  They can just cross their fingers and hope the enemy doesn't notice a starflare attack in the early game, or they have one moment just after the advent of Thors when the enemy will likely not have EMP missiles yet and armies might still be small enough that the Thor does better than the ESG.  Aside from that one weapon, Eden has inferior DPS and zero tactically interesting options that Plymouth doesn't also have.

Is your target for this AI a multiplayer opponent or a single player opponent, by the way?  If single player, just be aware that when making a stage with an Eden opponent, it'll need to have access to / start with more stuff than Plymouth would to be a challenge.
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Outpost 2 Divided Destiny / Re: Military Strategies
« Last post by TechCor on April 25, 2019, 06:00:29 AM »
Don't forget tube cutting  ;)
I mean, I'll admit the things I listed might be considered cheese tactics, but that's so dirty, it never even crossed my mind!

That led to me looking it up, and discovering SirBomber ranting complaining that Eden sucks. Acid clouds < ESG, Railgun < RPG, EMP missile end games, etc. Interesting, to be sure, but hard to breakdown into tactical descriptions.

It sounded like there were many fun multiplayer games back in the day. If only people recorded some of these...
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Outpost 2 Divided Destiny / Re: Military Strategies
« Last post by Hooman on April 25, 2019, 12:06:32 AM »
Don't forget tube cutting  ;)
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Projects / Re: OP2 Game Flow Redesign (PhaseShift v0.4.0 released!)
« Last post by Crow! on April 24, 2019, 10:18:24 PM »
Sure.  Here's the file.  I placed it in with the other files in the PhaseShift folder, and I told the mission to play sound sample 167 along with the message, but I got "Struture Lost", the unmodified version of the sound sample, instead.
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Projects / Re: OP2 Game Flow Redesign (PhaseShift v0.4.0 released!)
« Last post by Vagabond on April 24, 2019, 08:22:16 PM »
Crow!,

Could you post your new sound effect for troubleshooting? I've never attempted to replace a sound effect before so would need to look at it to give advice. Unsure if op2ext will pickup the new sound effect without testing.

Thanks,
Brett
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Projects / Re: OP2 Game Flow Redesign
« Last post by Crow! on April 24, 2019, 04:01:48 PM »
Phase Shift v0.4.0 is done, and is attached to this post!  A summary of the changes is here, too.

A couple outstanding coding issues remain, both regarding the hookup with op2ext:
- op2ext did not replace savnt213.wav, even though it was in the mod folder.  I might be misunderstanding how a .wav file replacement is done.  I want the mine depletion alert to say "Mining location diminishing," but instead it will just make the smelter selection noise.
- As noted by Vagabond above, there is some new functionality I'm waiting on; once it is ready, there should not need to be the separate vanilla vs phase shift versions of Ohana.  (For now, the PhaseShift download only contains the PhaseShift version of the map.)


Change log:
PhaseShift specific maps will now alert the player when a mine is running out.
A map specially designed for PhaseShift, Ohana, is now included with the mod!  (Bundled map version is 0.3)
Minor edits to Mine.txt to make it work better with the way the above mentioned alert is implemented.
Slight increase to mine "trickle" output after it has been depleted.
Initial maximum morale reduced; Medical Centers and the colony-specific morale topic effect on max morale increased.
   The important thing to know is that you must get something other than just Nursery and University tech to get beyond Poor morale.
Guard Post base price reduced.
Scorpion armor class is now None instead of Light.
Reduction of some buffs to Scorpion-related research rates.
EMP missile research cost and maximum scientist count increased.
Observatory's Scientist cost lowered.
Meteor Defense common metal, worker, and research costs lowered.

[EDIT] Replaced attachment with PhaseShift v0.4.1, which updates the Ohana map to version 0.4, which fixes an issue where Ohana's SE base's N wall wasn't solid.
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Projects / Re: OP2 Scenario Project for C#
« Last post by TechCor on April 24, 2019, 03:44:05 PM »
Yes, it seems issuing any command to the truck will resolve it. The issue is detecting that the problem is happening in the first place.

I'm thinking maybe adding a timer linked to the unit index to determine if they have been on the dock idling too long. Maybe a tenth of a second with "moDone" is all that is needed to determine that it's "gone bad". Not as elegant of a solution as I was hoping for, but any fix is better than no fix.

This solution might work for the movement problem as well, if pixelX/pixelY is a reliable way of telling if a unit is moving.

EDIT:

Checking for "spinning wheels" and waiting 200 ticks before issuing a stop command seems to work. Wish this kind of handling was built into the engine, but whatever.
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Projects / Re: OP2 Scenario Project for C#
« Last post by Crow! on April 24, 2019, 06:45:47 AM »
I've had the inability to unload cargo in the normal game from time to time.  The best way to fix it I've found is to order the truck to move onto the dock again, even if it's already on it.
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