Author Topic: Gay marrage  (Read 20010 times)

Offline CK9

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6226
    • http://www.outpost2.net/~ck9
Gay marrage
« Reply #25 on: April 08, 2004, 10:50:39 AM »
And how so?  What they choose is nobodies right to prevent except their own.
CK9 in outpost
Iamck in runescape (yes, I still play...sometimes...)
srentiln in minecraft (I like legos, and I like computer games...it was only a matter of time...) and youtube...
xdarkinsidex on deviantart

yup, I have too many screen names

Offline BlackBox

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3093
Gay marrage
« Reply #26 on: April 08, 2004, 11:18:02 AM »
Quote
I care because the bible says that it is wrong in many different ways. No it doesn't quote "Men shall not kiss and do other gross stuff" or anything but in an around and about way, it does say that it shouldn't be done. It is just disturbing to see two men even just holding hands.
It says this......

(It is talking to men here)

Quote
LEV 18:22 " `Do not lie with a man as one lies with a woman; that is detestable.

Phantom

  • Guest
Gay marrage
« Reply #27 on: April 08, 2004, 03:39:55 PM »
Quote
*sigh* With all this hate/dislike, discrimination and letting a book over two thousand years old guide your actions humanity will never progress

First of all, there is no hate or discrimination against anyone in the bible. It is the ACTs that are detestable, not the people themselves. To say otherwize is just out of ignorance.

Quote
As a note, im not screaming "Let the gay marry" im screaming "Why do you care if they marry or not?"

I'll tell you why we care, because it goes against the moral standerds of myself, and most of the country. Case closed.

And as I said earilier, we are to love the person, not their actions.

Offline CK9

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6226
    • http://www.outpost2.net/~ck9
Gay marrage
« Reply #28 on: April 10, 2004, 06:28:43 PM »
phantom, you have no right to say that you speak for the majority.  For all you know, the majority could be against you.  Even if it is the majority, since when is it always right?  Plato was forced to poison himself for his teachings, which today we hold many as true.  The Majority thougt the world was flat.  The majority thought that the universe revolved around the earth.

I'd rather die right now knowing that I stand for everyone having equal rights, the thing this country claims it stands for, than to live on and switch sides.
CK9 in outpost
Iamck in runescape (yes, I still play...sometimes...)
srentiln in minecraft (I like legos, and I like computer games...it was only a matter of time...) and youtube...
xdarkinsidex on deviantart

yup, I have too many screen names

Offline Zircon

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 585
Gay marrage
« Reply #29 on: April 10, 2004, 06:37:03 PM »
"I'd rather die right now knowing that I stand for everyone having equal rights, the thing this country claims it stands for, than to live on and switch sides."

I hereby present the price for the best sentence (up to now) ever made on this forum to you CK, that kind of view on life should be sought by everyone. *applause*

Offline CK9

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6226
    • http://www.outpost2.net/~ck9
Gay marrage
« Reply #30 on: April 10, 2004, 06:40:17 PM »
:eyebrow: are you making fun of me?
CK9 in outpost
Iamck in runescape (yes, I still play...sometimes...)
srentiln in minecraft (I like legos, and I like computer games...it was only a matter of time...) and youtube...
xdarkinsidex on deviantart

yup, I have too many screen names

Offline Zircon

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 585
Gay marrage
« Reply #31 on: April 10, 2004, 06:42:25 PM »
No i wasn't :(

*sigh* When im joking people take me seriously and when im serious to the point hell would freeze over people think im making fun of them  <_<  

Offline CK9

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6226
    • http://www.outpost2.net/~ck9
Gay marrage
« Reply #32 on: April 10, 2004, 06:44:48 PM »
it's just the way you say it.  Only the people it affects should be able to vote on this.
CK9 in outpost
Iamck in runescape (yes, I still play...sometimes...)
srentiln in minecraft (I like legos, and I like computer games...it was only a matter of time...) and youtube...
xdarkinsidex on deviantart

yup, I have too many screen names

Phantom

  • Guest
Gay marrage
« Reply #33 on: April 10, 2004, 10:15:48 PM »
Quote
phantom, you have no right to say that you speak for the majority. For all you know, the majority could be against you. Even if it is the majority, since when is it always right? Plato was forced to poison himself for his teachings, which today we hold many as true. The Majority thougt the world was flat. The majority thought that the universe revolved around the earth.

I think it was Socraties that poisoned himself, but I could be wrong.
It has been polled by all countrywide poles that the majority do not accept gay marrage. I do not just make stuff up just to tick people off, I do research my info.
And the majority can be right and still dissagree with your point of veiw.

Quote
I'd rather die right now knowing that I stand for everyone having equal rights, the thing this country claims it stands for, than to live on and switch sides.

This would be a good sentance if it were an equal rights issue, but this is a moral issue not an equal rights issue. So, that was pretty out of place.

Anyways, it enfringes upon the rights of those who are forced to recognize the marrage if their religion goes against it, violating the first ammendment.

Offline Maveric

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 4
Gay marrage
« Reply #34 on: April 12, 2004, 02:49:47 PM »
To say that homosexuality is not natural is to be ignorant. Male dogs sniff other male dogs backsides (not sure about female dogs tho) and some deep-sea invertibrates often try to reproduce with either and/or BOTH: 1) The wrong species and 2) The same sex. If you want proof, just google for it. Wether or not it's a choice they make or if they just dont know what they're screwing we're not sure of, but nonetheless they continue to do so.

Gay marrage isn't a problem; though i may dislike the thought of it, who am i to say that my thoughts and beliefs should be imposed on anyone? If they are happy, i am happy that they are happy; i suck it up, and keep living. Though i dislike the event of a homosexual couple kissing in a public place, i dont really care if they're told to stop or not; it's not me in that position.

Bad, Good, Evil - these are arbitrary. They will varry from one person from another; this is why we have wars. Thought good by another, thought evil from the other. By this it's impossible to force someone to do something against their will. They will continue their thought of it, for as long as they can live. What is deemed evil/good by one religion will fade away (may not completely dissapear) if said religion ends.

Gay marrage isn't a morality or human rights issue... it's an empathy issue. For referance, Empathy is: "Identification with and understanding of another's situation, feelings, and motives." If you can't put yourself "in their shoes," how are you to know if you're hurting them or not?


Too much hate... Too much ignorance... Not enough love... Not enough empathy. :find:
That dude that seems to come out of the graveyard every once and a while to see if the OutPost is still alive is me...
One of these day's i just might have to bring it back with me.

Please, dont let that day come.

Offline CK9

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6226
    • http://www.outpost2.net/~ck9
Gay marrage
« Reply #35 on: April 12, 2004, 06:24:33 PM »
Quote
Quote
I'd rather die right now knowing that I stand for everyone having equal rights, the thing this country claims it stands for, than to live on and switch sides.

This would be a good sentance if it were an equal rights issue, but this is a moral issue not an equal rights issue. So, that was pretty out of place.

Anyways, it enfringes upon the rights of those who are forced to recognize the marrage if their religion goes against it, violating the first ammendment.
it is a matter of equal rights, phantom.  Just because it is against your moral standards, doesn't mean they shouldn't have the right to choose to marry.

and as maveric pointed out, it happens in many species, not just humans.  We overcrowd the world, so what if a group of people are diffeent from you?  Adressing (I believe) Lev's statement, so what if they are unable to reproduce and continue the species?  There are millions of people who can do that, and everyone can have the same rights still.
CK9 in outpost
Iamck in runescape (yes, I still play...sometimes...)
srentiln in minecraft (I like legos, and I like computer games...it was only a matter of time...) and youtube...
xdarkinsidex on deviantart

yup, I have too many screen names

Phantom

  • Guest
Gay marrage
« Reply #36 on: April 13, 2004, 12:57:29 AM »
Quote
Male dogs sniff other male dogs backsides (not sure about female dogs tho)

Ok, this example makes no sence whatsoever.

Quote
What is deemed evil/good by one religion will fade away (may not completely dissapear) if said religion ends.

Well, it hasnt faded for 6000+ years, and I don't think it will be anytime soon.

First of all Maveric is giving non sensical and unrelated examples.
You are comparing animals that have no sence of anything to human beings which are the only sentient life on the planet.

It makes no sence to compare creatures that have no knowledge of right and wrong to those who do.

Plus, it is not natural. In some animal species it is, but this is not the case with humans.

Plus, Homosexuality reffers to sexual acts. The people called this are not just calling themselves this because they like to live with the same sex.

Quote
it's impossible to force someone to do something against their will

Yes, that is the case with both sides of the argument, this is a majority rules statement.

And in this case like it or not, the fact is that the majority will rule in this case regardless of whether we like it or not.
« Last Edit: April 13, 2004, 01:01:04 AM by Phantom »

Offline CK9

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6226
    • http://www.outpost2.net/~ck9
Gay marrage
« Reply #37 on: April 13, 2004, 09:01:03 AM »
phantom, 6000?  don't you mean hundred?  Christianity has not been around 6000 years yet.
CK9 in outpost
Iamck in runescape (yes, I still play...sometimes...)
srentiln in minecraft (I like legos, and I like computer games...it was only a matter of time...) and youtube...
xdarkinsidex on deviantart

yup, I have too many screen names

Offline xamlit

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 160
Gay marrage
« Reply #38 on: April 13, 2004, 02:41:35 PM »
Okay, I totally agree with OP2 hacker. I am also a christian. Just think would you mind 2 gay males hanging around your 4 year old son? Which would warrant greater concern? Two Gay males or Two straight as a ruler dudes?

Offline Zircon

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 585
Gay marrage
« Reply #39 on: April 13, 2004, 03:08:52 PM »
Ofcourse we understand that, but does that give you the right to deny them marry because of your morals.

Besides, why would they want to hang around your 4 year old son  :blink:

Gay isnt the same as pedophilia.

Offline it2000us

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 350
Gay marrage
« Reply #40 on: April 13, 2004, 03:18:56 PM »
From what i hear, gay people are born with a bad mind mentaly thats why they'r gay. Its like genetics, in my oppinion you can be gay as long as you want but im deffinetly against gay marriage. Because lets just face it, its not normal in our world to mary same sex. So thats why we should stick to the rules and beliefs of our world. If you dont like it o well.

Phantom

  • Guest
Gay marrage
« Reply #41 on: April 13, 2004, 04:49:34 PM »
Quote
phantom, 6000? don't you mean hundred? Christianity has not been around 6000 years yet.

Christianity has been around 2000 years yes, however, the old testement, in which the law is written, was written and recorded well over six thousand years ago.

Quote
Gay isnt the same as pedophilia.

However the same group (ACLU) that supports gay marrage also supports Child/Adult sex.

It is true that homosexuals may be born with different likes and dislikes. However, it is their choice whether to have same sex relations or not.
And the parents of homosexuals don't help much.
For example, in a report, a mother is quoted saying
"I knew that he was gay when he was three. He liked the color pink."
The parents then give special/abnormal treatment to the boy, causing him to believe he is gay.

First of all, not only is this total absurdity (What person in their right mind would say that Pink is a homosexual color?) but it contributed to abnormal thinking that led to eventual homosexuality.

And since the beginning of recorded history, it is recorded that homosexuality was not even allowed, much less tolerated.

Gay marrage would infringe on my rights, and the rights of every other person who is against homosexual marrage.

Offline CK9

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6226
    • http://www.outpost2.net/~ck9
Gay marrage
« Reply #42 on: April 13, 2004, 08:25:21 PM »
And what right is that?

Chritianity as a religion has many flaws in it, as with budism and Jewdism.  I bet I could find flaws in other religions too if I knew enough about them.

The worst part about this debate is that you guys keep saying it isn't natural.  There is one example that stands out in my mind that would show otherwise: Kowalas.  It is quite natural for a female in a group of them to mimic the acts of a male during that season.

and for another that is less prominant, in some species of snakes, a male will make itself appear as a female in order to get the other males to go after him so ha can be the only one after the real female.

I realy shouldn't have watched the National Geographic channel from ages 4 to 10

(woa, I just moticed a giant welt on my arm, I guess the trees hate me, lol)
CK9 in outpost
Iamck in runescape (yes, I still play...sometimes...)
srentiln in minecraft (I like legos, and I like computer games...it was only a matter of time...) and youtube...
xdarkinsidex on deviantart

yup, I have too many screen names

Phantom

  • Guest
Gay marrage
« Reply #43 on: April 14, 2004, 11:24:58 AM »
Again, sentient beings are being compared to the non-sentient.

There is no comparison between humans and animals. Sorry to say but it is true.

Plus, saying that flaws are in a religion is an opinion, and seeing as how every other religion has changed in a matter of a few hundred years, the bible has not changed in over six thousand, this is proven from carbon dating of old scrolls that were found.

Anyways, it is not natural for the HUMAN race. I don't really care about what animals do what.

Offline CK9

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6226
    • http://www.outpost2.net/~ck9
Gay marrage
« Reply #44 on: April 14, 2004, 06:32:10 PM »
Quote
Again, sentient beings are being compared to the non-sentient.

There is no comparison between humans and animals. Sorry to say but it is true.

Plus, saying that flaws are in a religion is an opinion, and seeing as how every other religion has changed in a matter of a few hundred years, the bible has not changed in over six thousand, this is proven from carbon dating of old scrolls that were found.

Anyways, it is not natural for the HUMAN race. I don't really care about what animals do what.
sorry to break it to you phantom, but humans are animals.
CK9 in outpost
Iamck in runescape (yes, I still play...sometimes...)
srentiln in minecraft (I like legos, and I like computer games...it was only a matter of time...) and youtube...
xdarkinsidex on deviantart

yup, I have too many screen names

Phantom

  • Guest
Gay marrage
« Reply #45 on: April 15, 2004, 03:32:08 PM »
I was making the comparison between sentient and non-sentient beings CK9, not if humans are animals or not.

Offline BlackBox

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3093
Gay marrage
« Reply #46 on: April 15, 2004, 03:54:33 PM »
For those types of animals it may be the only way to reproduce....
Also you must remember some animals are hermaphrodites (have both male and female sex organs) so they can have sex with themselves OR with each other...

Comparing animals that dont have a high level brain (I'll put other primates here too.. its not like most gorillas can write and drive and do taxes etc) to humans doesn't hold any water.

I also don't think being gay is in born. So you can't say they can't help it. It is learned. (Sure there are some genetic variables that can help influence a person to be gay or straight, but that doesn't decide 100 % of the picture). Genes are the only way you can inherit traits, and there's no gene that *will be* the deciding factor whether the person is gay or not.

Therefore you can't call it "Something they can't help" because part of it is chosen by them.

Being gay is seen as wrong by most people in this country... It's just not considered normal.

Just because maybe male to male contact between animals is normal for the animals, but it's not normal for humans.

Btw CK... I don't think the religion has flaws itself, its flaws in how it's interpreted.

Phantom

  • Guest
Gay marrage
« Reply #47 on: April 15, 2004, 04:06:25 PM »
Gay marrage is not protected by the 9th amendment.

"The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people."

The statement means that the constitution cannot be changed to violate rights as set by the constitution.

There is nothing in the constitution that gives gives rights to gay marrage, therefore, an ammendment banning same sex marrage would not be in violation.
« Last Edit: April 15, 2004, 04:06:48 PM by Phantom »

Offline CK9

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6226
    • http://www.outpost2.net/~ck9
Gay marrage
« Reply #48 on: April 15, 2004, 08:37:18 PM »
Quote
I was making the comparison between sentient and non-sentient beings CK9, not if humans are animals or not.
your wording flat out implies that you find them seperate.
CK9 in outpost
Iamck in runescape (yes, I still play...sometimes...)
srentiln in minecraft (I like legos, and I like computer games...it was only a matter of time...) and youtube...
xdarkinsidex on deviantart

yup, I have too many screen names

Phantom

  • Guest
Gay marrage
« Reply #49 on: May 09, 2004, 12:50:48 AM »
Do you know what sentient and non-sentient means?