Author Topic: Measure Words And Countable  (Read 1704 times)

Offline Hooman

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4955
Measure Words And Countable
« on: March 13, 2009, 02:27:17 AM »
Let's talk about measure words. What is a measure word? Well, it tells you what unit of measure you're using, such as a slice of bread, vs. a loaf of bread. In some languages, such as English, such measure words are often optional. For instance, did you see a sheep, or a herd of sheep? In other languages, a measure word is always required. Why are they relevant? Well, they're important when it comes to pluralizing words or counting things. Some objects are inherently countable, such as people. You can walk into a room and count them up, one at a time. Other words are not countable, such as water. You can't simply say 1 water, 2 water, .... Indeed, what would "1 water" be? For something so fluid and easily divisible, with no way to tell the whole from the parts, it's not ovious. Maybe a single atom perhaps? That hardly seems like a sane default measurment though. You can however add a measure word in front of water, and count the measures, such as 1 bottle of water.

Now, why would I bring up such a silly topic?
Quite simply put, I've noticed a certain lack of agreement on whether "code" is countable or not. Certainly lines of code are countable, but "lines" is a measure word. Generally, I've grown up believing "code" to be like "water", in that it is not countable. Perhaps because like water, an abstract concept like "thought" is not easily measured. Plus, if "code" is not given a measure word, what is it's default measure? Certainly in the case of "a sheep", there is no confusion as to the quantity of sheep when the measure word is omitted. (Here the "a" would stand for the numeral, and denote there is one unit of something). Note also that words with an optional measure word can be pluralized such as "1 coin"/"2 coins", (although, sometimes the plural is itself, like "sheep"). You don't however see "waters" written anywhere (which of course is completely different from "water's ...").

So, now that I've come to take language a little more seriously, and to think a little harder about what those rules we all tend to use actually are, I've come to wonder about this one. Is "code" countable?

I've also come to wonder about other languages, and what their rules are for measure words and countability. Perhaps the reason for this being, that the majority of people (but not all) that I see writing "codes" seem to speak English as a second language. (Admittedly, it's a little hard to tell in some cases).


So then my questions are:
1) Do you think "code" is countable?
2) Are you a native English speaker?
3) If you're not a native English speaker, what language do you speak, and what are the rules (according to your best guess at least) for measure words and countability in your language?
 

Offline WooJoo

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 90
Measure Words And Countable
« Reply #1 on: March 13, 2009, 03:24:49 AM »
ok that topic is sure complicated

"codes" would i use for a divided format such as i have code as 1 file / i have codes at two or more files/  i think of the restriction as the code is always one part its not seperated as into more then 1 file. But im not english and i dont life at a country where english is a spoken language. still that code is not count able for me since 1 word code would be a syntax.
 
well i hope that does make any sence since im an alien to english xD


 

Offline Sirbomber

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3238
Measure Words And Countable
« Reply #2 on: March 13, 2009, 09:10:35 AM »
I've never really thought of "code" and "codes" referring to the same thing.  "Code" is something you write in a compiler.  "Codes" are something you use in a game for a little extra "assistance" and is synonymous with "cheats."

Let's look at two example sentences:
"I have some code that could help you with that."
The way I interpret that: Basically, I've done something stupid in an OP2 DLL and Hooman is coming to rescue me.  :P

"I have some codes that could help you with that."
The way I interpret that: Eden Mission #7 blows hard so I'm going to use "Dan's dog could make more ore." to instantly win and protect my sanity from further deterioration (not that there's any left anymore).
"As usual, colonist opinion is split between those who think the plague is a good idea, and those who are dying from it." - Outpost Evening Star

Outpost 2 Coding 101 Tutorials

Offline CK9

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6226
    • http://www.outpost2.net/~ck9
Measure Words And Countable
« Reply #3 on: March 19, 2009, 03:46:33 PM »
1) Do you think "code" is countable?

  yes, just not in conventional means.  For example, we say "a code" to denote that we have a single grouping of words and symbols that serve to tell a computer what to do.  Like sheep and people, there are no size limitations to what is considered a single code.  Therefore, you can have a simple "hello world" file, or an entire forum code.

2) Are you a native English speaker?

 No, I'm a speaker of American English.  If you have questions, ask a brit about it :P
 
CK9 in outpost
Iamck in runescape (yes, I still play...sometimes...)
srentiln in minecraft (I like legos, and I like computer games...it was only a matter of time...) and youtube...
xdarkinsidex on deviantart

yup, I have too many screen names

Offline Moley

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 95
Measure Words And Countable
« Reply #4 on: March 19, 2009, 04:05:09 PM »
i have allways thought that code was a password......

wouln't it be the lines?

yes i am a native amercan english speaker....
I HATE SPELLING!!!!!!
if i spell something or screw up grammer,
ignore it or tell me if you dont understand what i typed.

Offline Hooman

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4955
Measure Words And Countable
« Reply #5 on: March 21, 2009, 01:45:23 PM »
Quote
2) Are you a native English speaker?

No, I'm a speaker of American English. If you have questions, ask a brit about it

Hah!

Seriously though, they're really not all that different. The accent changes, and a few spellings change, but the grammar is pretty much the same.


Quote
Like sheep and people, there are no size limitations to what is considered a single code.
So a single sheep could be a slice of meat for dinner? That just doesn't sound right. I'm thinking it's more that "sheep" or "person" has an implied measure, which is actually quite specific. If I say "that person over there", and point to two people, you would probably assume I meant one of them, and not both.


As a side note, I'm reminded of something I read a long while back. It went something like: "He was half German, half Italian, and half French. He was a very large man."



I think I'll agree with Sirbomber about the distinction between "code" and "codes". I do think of two conceptually different things when I hear that.