Author Topic: Buying Gta, Coffeegate  (Read 2295 times)

Offline dm-horus

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Buying Gta, Coffeegate
« on: October 27, 2006, 03:22:16 PM »
I have been holding off buying Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas because I was still totally into Vice City. However, I recently mangled my install disk so Im taking it as a cue to go out and finally buy SA. I knew that because of the hot coffee issue, I probably wouldnt be able to use the mods to reveal that content but thats cool. However, I recently read this article which makes me wonder if I should bother buying it at all.

Basically the article makes it clear that NO MODS work with GTA:SA at all. No weapon mods, no new vehicles, nothing. The versions of GTA:SA on shelves have been hardened to prevent modding, which in effect has killed the mod scene around GTA titles completely.

A huge reason for my love of the GTA series is how rich the mod scene around it was. From what Im reading at least that aspect is totally dead and buried, along with parts of the fan and support base. Apparently Rockstar has gone so far as to refuse speaking with developers, game sites and publications, refuse to release fansite packs or even screenshots. I have to ask the question at the end of the Gamasutra article: Is Rockstar the heartless, greedy and exploitative company Jack Thompson made it out to be? Nobody wants to agree with him but is he right about at least this aspect of the issue? All these things make me wonder if I should even bother with the game even though its something Ive been looking forward to.

So my question is, what are my options? Are there still unhardened (no jokes, plz) versions of GTA:SA floating around on shelves? Are there tools to let me mod the game so I can still use mods? Should I download a torrent?
« Last Edit: October 27, 2006, 03:29:46 PM by dm-horus »
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Offline siqueule

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Buying Gta, Coffeegate
« Reply #1 on: October 27, 2006, 05:58:26 PM »
you want to get one of the first versions of gta sa to experiment the hot-coffee mod? sur ebay, that could be purchasable
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Offline dm-horus

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Buying Gta, Coffeegate
« Reply #2 on: October 27, 2006, 10:59:21 PM »
well i dont want ti for hot coffee, i just want a version that will work with mods. i like the mods that let me add more weapons, vehicles, etc. and if the versions on shelves wont let me do that then id have to think twice about spending money on it.
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Offline siqueule

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Buying Gta, Coffeegate
« Reply #3 on: October 28, 2006, 09:52:08 AM »
I see just an old version of gta sa or make pressure on rockstar's forums... who is jack thompson?
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Offline Leviathan

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Buying Gta, Coffeegate
« Reply #4 on: October 28, 2006, 10:09:42 AM »
gta sux

op2 owns

Offline Arklon

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Buying Gta, Coffeegate
« Reply #5 on: October 28, 2006, 01:42:13 PM »
Quote
who is jack thompson?
You've never heard of Jackass Thompson?!

Offline siqueule

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« Reply #6 on: October 28, 2006, 05:09:20 PM »
not really... this name say me somethink but I don't rember what  :huh:  
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Offline dm-horus

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Buying Gta, Coffeegate
« Reply #7 on: October 28, 2006, 10:49:07 PM »
siqueule, Ive got Jack Thompsons name linked to an article about him. Click on it to read all about his psychotic rantings.
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Offline siqueule

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Buying Gta, Coffeegate
« Reply #8 on: October 29, 2006, 05:27:19 AM »
I see... "christian conservative" he say that gta generate psychopats, isn't it?

I hates when man say that, that  give me desire to go out and shoot walkers  :P  
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Offline BlackBox

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Buying Gta, Coffeegate
« Reply #9 on: October 29, 2006, 01:17:37 PM »
Quote
Basically the article makes it clear that NO MODS work with GTA:SA at all. No weapon mods, no new vehicles, nothing. The versions of GTA:SA on shelves have been hardened to prevent modding, which in effect has killed the mod scene around GTA titles completely.
Whoever says that, is full of crap. You have access to the executable file itself -- that in and of itself gives you something to rip into, modify, hack, etc.
There isn't any sort of hardware lock that can prevent you from seeing or modifying the code.

(Well, sure, there might be a checksum where the EXE looks at its own code for changes, and there might be other nasty things they try to do to keep you from looking at the code [self modifying / obfuscated code for example], but that cannot lock you out).

Bottom line is: If your computer can run it, you can hack it and mod it in anyway you want. All that matters is how much you're willing to work on it.

If they want a completely unmoddable game, build a black box PC that can only run the single game (i.e. hardwired logic as the original Pong game used). Even then, it is possible to unlock / unharden / modify (They did it with the first Xbox. A few hundred bytes of boot code are buried inside the southbridge of the machine, I think its main purpose is to send an encryption key to decrypt and start loading the main BIOS from a rom chip. This was cracked / bypassed when someone stuck a logic analyser on the bus coming out of the southbridge, they were able to capture the encryption key and decrypt the boot rom themselves).

If a mod doesn't exist now, one probably will sometime (someone will work through the code and create a mod).

As for multiplayer modes; the mods probably wouldn't work with other clients who didn't use the same mods (think of OP2 and trainers. If all players run the trainer the result is fine; if not all players run the trainer the game desynches or crashes).
If all players used the mod (they would have to be aware of this, the game wouldn't be able to tell the other players in the session (for obvious reasons)), it should work. (Provided all necessary checksumming / other operations that verify the software integrity and send information to the online servers have been circumvented).

Also, I would imagine you can find a torrent online of the original version -- buy the new version, download the torrent, install that.

Offline dm-horus

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Buying Gta, Coffeegate
« Reply #10 on: October 29, 2006, 05:00:15 PM »
Yea I think torrent is the best option at this point.

The issue about the mods is that the modding community grew pretty huge and all the mods that exist will not work with the hardened version of GTA:SA and apparently people are so disallusioned that nobody is porting their mods to the new structure and nobody is taking the time to make new mods that will work.
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