Cargo Lander

[omagaalpha]

Cargo lander


Related ideas:

- none

Table content
- Seed starter module
- Cargo lander
- Colonist Lander

Description:

Orignal from outpost 1, it has all basic suppley for coloney. When command center is completed you can choose land this.
I. it capable of storeing follow stuff
A. 5000 ore
B.  5000 food
C. as well (genetic datababk)
D. clothing
E. Tools
F. also AI computer to help in tasks
G. other basic stuff. (sorry no units in this one)
------------------------below new additon---------------------------------
It would use when create coloney from outspace to deliever supply for struture and a cargo truck and convex to build a first building.

Also think since high storage ores that can use transport mass smelter ore/food to another coloney/base.

-->will be use in game to transport miltiary unit to enemy base<-----
This is a good idea, because:

- add realise and make like the coloney start from outspace

This is a bad idea, because:
- to complex for beginning of game

[Vexhare]

More ore and more food, you send 10000 common ore, 10000 rare ore, 10000 food, why not get them all when you land?

[Jgamer]

How about space issues? I don't think that these ores are that dense.

[omagaalpha]

lol problem could not hold that many but issuse solve when final deceided ideas to use

[dm-horus]

sort of like a space based cargo truck. not a bad idea. it would emphasize resource stockpiling in the game. i dont know how well it would work since most players are likely to use every ounce of every resource they have instead of stashing it away for later. most multiplayer games dont last long enough to have large amounts of leftovers. might work well in a custom campaign though.

[Freeza-CII]

This clearly isnt a multiplayer vec.  The problem with storing in a place or unit that you cant access right away means you have to wait and that wait could mean the doom of your colony.

Possiblities of this vec are Trade of good between players in larger quanities.  How ever there is a problem if you want some realism.

Ore is heavy s*** the size of a rocket or engine you would need to move that ammount of ore would be very BIG.  Just to get 4 people and about 50 ton in space now takes those 2 solid booster and that big orange tank of liquid O2.  Now you have to add on the weight of the fuel as well.

[TH300]

I think, omaga meant it not to be built in game, but to be landed in the very beginning of the campaign when arriving on a new planet.

What you are talking about is a cargo transport rocket. And since in op2 a rocket can launch 10000 ore into space, it might be realistic.

[omagaalpha]

Plus you are assumming earthling technology level. They have better rocket technoloogy for Cargo Lander so it quite capabile of lift that much ore.

[Freeza-CII]

Rocket tech can only be so good  What does that 10000 units mean Tons mega tone pounds.  if tons 10000 ton is very heavy and getting some thing that heavy off the surface of landing it would never happen dont care how good your rockets are your going to need alot of them.  in landing you have to break the fall basicly Escape Velocity in reverse kinda.  Then taking off would be insane to reach EV.

[BlackBox]

Ore is heavy s*** the size of a rocket or engine you would need to move that ammount of ore would be very BIG.  Just to get 4 people and about 50 ton in space now takes those 2 solid booster and that big orange tank of liquid O2.  Now you have to add on the weight of the fuel as well.

Who's to say it has to be anything like today's rocket booster technology?

The Conestoga used ion propulsion engines instead of solid-rocket boosters.

[Stormy]

The problem with ion propulsion is that I think it uses a small amount of fuel, but it DOES add up over a bit of time. It's better for long distance interstellar travel... however it might be possible to like, fly around the planet until you've gotten enough speed....... That could take too long though....

What about a catapult of some sort?

[BlackBox]

Well, I don't say it has to use ion propulsion, but it can use technologies that we know exist but haven't been constructed yet.

[Betaray]

if this is to be launched from the planet and stored in space it basicly needs chemical rocket fuel, nothing else has the raw thrust required (no not even nuclear, its because with chemical the fuel itself provides both the mass and energy for propulsion, meaning the more mass put in, the more energy comes out, with other systems such as nuclear it uses a reactor to heat a working fluid to produce thrust, thus the more fluid the less energy a givin volume of fluid has and the less efficent the rocket)

a cargo pod of this size would weigh easily upwards of 1000 tonnes, with a conventual rocket system the energy required to put that amount of mass in even low orbit would be on bar with a mid grade atom bomb going off at the launch site

op2 got away with this because it launced the parts in piecemeal, no one part would weigh much over 200 tonnes thus the blast on the launch pad would be limited, as well as the fuel necessary to be carried on board

frankly from an engineering stand point building a reliable launch platform able to lift such a payload would be an extremely daunting task, expecially if it would have to use current launch platforms and have close proxcemity to the coloney (in fact the blast wave produced from the launch would make it nessacary for the launch pad to be many miles away from the rest of the coloney)

even if they are on a planet with a lower gravity and a thinner atmosphere I dont think the coloney would wish to spend the resources developing and building such a rocket if the current systems are reusible and are able to do the same job, albit over many trips

now if the coloney decides to further alternitive meathods of getting into space, such as a space teather, or a mass driver thats another story altogather

[omagaalpha]

well there use tracker beam from out space pull up ship so no fuel is need.
Still point out that just because not fesible to you does not mean in the future they will not be able to lift that much into orbit with not lot of fuel.

After all in atosmphere solid rocket fuel is not only option. So could use different boost ship until point moleclue too far part for a method to work.

[Betaray]

excuse me...what?

[Tellaris]

Just to point out...
Tokamaks.
Fusion Drive.
Obviously, by the time this game takes place, Fusion technology is already understood and applied.   Therefore, it is reasonable to assume that their rockets are capeable of using fusion drive, rather then the current chemical rockets we have now.

[omagaalpha]

point too Baikon --that what I was try to say

[Stormy]

hm, if we keep getting all these great ideas... and we implement them in the game... we will need to figure out what they will look like

but that's for later ..

I like all these ideas; we're really moving along with them aren't we?

[Betaray]

ok, heres the thing about fusion, yes it has a very high specific impulse, but it dosnt have the raw thrust to lauch a rocket from the surface

its not a matter of technology, its a matter of physics and chemistry

and anyways the energy required to launch somthing the size of this cargo lander would be in the range of a mid level nuclear bomb, the blast wave alone from the launch would be enough to flatten even a CC from many miles away

I like the idea of cargo, but I think it should be launched piecemeal, like it was for the starship

[FallTime]

In my humble opinion, the fusion drives work like this - fusion core supplies energy and gives it out to ionize the "fuel". Thus, it is just ion drive, which does use fusion reaction to power itself instead of solar panels. I can't see how else could it work - even the nuclear drives have to work like this (again, IMHO). The only other option I can see is that the working matter would be different, or they wouldn't use ionized particles but the energy itself instead - highly unlikely, because they would have no "mass"...

Rather, I think that for carrying heavy cargo to orbit should be carried out with the use of Massdrivers - those are even being developped in present time. They are very cheap - you eliminate the additional weight of fuel needed to get it on the orbit. In Outpost 1, there is suggested, that a net is based on the orbit to chatch the cargo, but even this shouldn't be necessary. Either way, I think it is the cheapest and fastest way to carry cargo - of course you cannot use it to carry personel or sensitive materials. But for ore, food...  

[CK9]

I say use the vehicle, and have it travel a space teather.  Of course, we ould have to assume that research on carbone tubules has progressed rather well

[omagaalpha]

I say use the vehicle, and have it travel a space teather.  Of course, we ould have to assume that research on carbone tubules has progressed rather well

what heck would you do that and what waste of resourser to build tether.
if go like that let assume massive breakthrough in research(revolutionize chemisty and physics) make engines does not give nuclear bomb force out .

[Chandler]

In my humble opinion, the fusion drives work like this - fusion core supplies energy and gives it out to ionize the "fuel". Thus, it is just ion drive, which does use fusion reaction to power itself instead of solar panels.

IMO >>>

Nuclear Fusion - The combining of two atoms, usually Deuterium and Tritium (w/e its called) to create a high temperature plasma, normally contained within a magnetic field.

In Fusion Reactors - This plasma is used to superheat water to steam and turn a turbine.
In Fusion Drives - This plasma would be directed by magnetic fields through a thruster, using Neutons 3rd Law "Every reaction has an equal and opposite reaction." The "Push" of the plasma back would push the ship forwards.

Ion Drive - Uses electric fields to eject charged particles (Ions) through a thruster, end result as above. (Think TIE from Star Wars - TIE Fighter = Twin Ion Engine Fighter)

<<< IMO

[Stormy]

Don't ion drives emit small particles at small speeds, but after a while, they add up a LOT (like I said earlier). This can make a more efficient interstellar/above planet engine, but there is no way to get it to launch off the ground. First, the ion has to give the ship momentum. When it isn't even counter-acting gravity, it for sure won't move a multi-ton (hehe) cargo load.

[croxis]

Current ion drives put out a force about the weight of a peice of paper on yourhand, its used for long distances as mentioned.  It can't do any kind of surface lauch.  An orion engine might

I do like the idea of a lander for the campain or some kind of epic multiplayer setting.  Heck I liked the whole idea of deciding what to load onto the ship before it leaves Earth.  While obviously applicable for a single player game, I can see this being used for some multiplayer games as well with each player loading their own spaceship, or players agree on a single loadout and thne it is devided into half (or whatever the case may be).