I'm Having A Hard Time With Eden Starship

[Zanderist]

Any strats?

[Highlander]

Where is it things go wrong ?

[Zanderist]

Where is it things go wrong ?

Mainly With the workers and Scientist, They always are kill themsleves.

And constant attacks.

How do I get the EMP weapon?

I can't beat it on Normal now...

They are far more advance than me, they have all the RPGs EMPs ESGs Super Novas, Missles.

and all I have is laser
 

[Sl0vi]

You need to keep a close eye on moral, when you start the game your first priority is to get it up. Start by building enough residences and agridomes, get a lab up, research training programs, then health maintanance and then offspring enhancement. Build a university, enough medical centers and a nursery. You need the nursery and university for your population to be able to grow AT ALL! Medical centers decrease the death rate of your colonists and improves morale if you have enough. Good morale increases birthrate and decreases deathrate

A good idea is to research environmental psychology to increase residence capacity and automated diagnostic examinations to increase medical center capacity very early in the game. This means you'll need fewer of these buildings to meet the colony's demand, and will free up more workers for you, and you'll need as many free workers as possible.

At the start of the game go for the beacon to the north, it is always a 3 bar, while the one to the south is random. A 3 bar will give you a lot more resources, and will really help you get your colony on its feet faster. Just make sure to prepare to move to the beacon to the south when the lava destroys the one to the north.

Also, don't research leisure studies and similar stuff. If you haven't researched it, you won't need to build recreation facilities to keep morale up, which also means you don't need to waste precious workers on them.

As for weapons tech, you'll need to research cybernetic tele-operation and large scale optical resonators. Build an advanced lab, research High Temperature Superconductivity, mobile weapons platform and rare ore extraction. Then research advanced combat chassis and you should get access to EMP and Railgun tech's. Unless if I forgot one tech in there...

Take a look at the tech tree in the OP2 section of the website, it should help you a bit atleast in figuring out what techs you'll need.

[Zanderist]

Alright but would it be wise if I build the Lab standard and VF, that I idle them because of Disabled buildings?

Alright I just give up, this is impossible on normal or hard

[Hooman]

Feel free to idle buildings to free up workers. Idled buildings don't decrease morale, but disabled buildings do. You should keep at least one lab up though, and always be researching. Idle workers also decrease morale, and if you have a load of scientists doing nothing it's not going to be good. Plus you really need to research stuff fairly fast to stay on top. Don't be afraid to idle your SF if there's no new buildings you need. Maybe rotate workers between a SF and VF as you need to use each.


Always go for the 3 bar mine that gets covered by lava on normal or hard. You should be able to build a new mine elsewhere before it gets destroyed. If not, then work on your building and order of research until you can.

If you can get laser lynxes early on, you can go sack their base in the top left before they get a chance to defend it properly. That means you'll have a lot less to deal with later on as that base won't be sending units at you.

If you can get the base in the top left, you can probably also get the base in the top right a little after that. Then they can't send missiles at you, or units from that base.

You can also go for their main base right at the beginning. It's probably harder to do, but it's possible. That really cuts down on attacks later on and makes it pretty easy.


If you do kill the enemy base, be aware that killing certain buildings will decrease your morale which will really hurt your population levels. Killing a CC, SF, VF or Advanced Lab is always a good idea. Sometimes you just want to gut the important innards of their base and move on to the next. You can always cleanup afterwards if you want to.


I find that level is easiest when you get a good start and go on the offensive and kill something. If you get forced back into a defensive position, the game tends to take a lot longer and is usually much harder. If that happens, you really want to get Thor's Hammer as quickly as possible, and some way of dealing with missiles.

Btw, a cheap trick for dealing with missiles, is sticking a unit far north of your main group a little out of the way. They tend to missile the unit that's farthest north, so leave one as bait. Just make sure it doesn't get killed easily. That is, put it somewhere where you can defend it against attacks with units to the south. Like how the lava kinda loops up and around and comes back down a little. That seems to be a good way of handling it.

[Zanderist]

Okay I'm about to have another go at this map again, I had eveything all going all my Reds, and MC's were with 30% morale and then this massive attack force came, and I knew right away that it was over.

What I started offin the lab was Health Maintance first, got one MC.

Then offspring enhacement, got the Nursery.

Then got the University. then..

Then Health Capcity and Reds Capcity increase.

I went for Cyber. Teleport. to have a Robo miner ready for the fall of my Northern mine.

I had the AL, up and got high temp. researched.

Then SL got the Laser at this point I was only researching with 1 scientist per lab.

But my colony had workers quickly replace dead workers.

my problem is I don't know what would be effective to research first.


 

[Highlander]

I always get Nursury, University and then Medical centre.


What you need to focus on is to get EMP, preferably with the range and fire rate upgrade, as quickly as you can.

Another tip is to bring the battle to your enemy rather than having it in your own base. (A very old tactic, but people now a days seem to have forgotten it)
I this case it means picking the enemy units off as they go to their rally point, rather than waiting for the full wave to hit your base.

[Zanderist]

I always get Nursury, University and then Medical centre.


What you need to focus on is to get EMP, preferably with the range and fire rate upgrade, as quickly as you can.

Another tip is to bring the battle to your enemy rather than having it in your own base. (A very old tactic, but people now a days seem to have forgotten it)
I this case it means picking the enemy units off as they go to their rally point, rather than waiting for the full wave to hit your base.

I've done that this time but still lost, I run out of money

[Hooman]

I often go for Metallogeny first. It helps to get more ore faster, which is especially useful in the beginning.

I often don't bother with Medical Centers. It takes a long time for the benefit of medical centers to pay off, and if I want to kill the computer early on, then I need the techs that will pay of now. Think of it this way, you're tying up a worker and scientist workign at the med center, which will eventually prevent the death of a worker and med center, some time in the future. It basically puts you further behind early on since you can't use that worker and scientist to do something else. Also, once you've researched med centers, it requires you to build and operate them to prevent negative morale effects, which wouldn't be there if they weren't researched.

Offspring Enhancement and Research Training Programs are definately necessary fairly early in the game. If you haven't gotten a university and a nursery by the time you've killed the computer, you'll probably just die off naturally anyways.

Cybernetic teleoperation is needed fairly early. Particularly if you go for the north mine since you need to build another mine before it gets destroyed. You'll also need a VF to produce those laser lynx if you're going to kill the computer early on.

If you're going to build an army early on, then you'll need to get Mobile Weapons Platform. This means you'll need to have researched the laser. This allows you to start building your army faster, rather than if you'd researched high temperature superconductivity. Once you're army is being built, THEN you research techs that lead to making your army stronger. It's not a bad thing to have your army half way to the computer's base by the time you get the techs to make them suddenly all stronger.



Avoid researching at two different labs at the same time, unless you have more than enough scientists to keep one lab fully busy. Here is why:

Consider this simplified case, where you have two techs you want to research, the techs take just as long to research, and your number of scientists doesn't outnumber how many you can throw at either tech. Let's say it takes 1 unit of time to research one tech if you put all your scientists towards it. After one unit of time, you'll immediately get the benefit of that tech (or can start building a structure it allows), and then can throw all those scientists at the second tech. After another unit of time (2 units of time total), you'll have the second tech and begin recieving the benefits from it. Remember that the whole time you were researching the second tech, you were receiving the benefit from the first tech, or already working towards what it allows you to build.

Now, if you research both techs at once, with equal number of scientists, you won't receive either tech until 2 time units have passed. In which case, you'll have wasted 1 time unit where you could have been receiving the benefit from one of the techs. Further, if those techs allow you to build something (worse if not having that building once it's researched hurts morale) then you're swamped with trying to build both things at once. Which means delays in getting buildings up, and quite possibly lower morale due to not having a structure operational.

 

[Brazilian Fan]

Another tip is to bring the battle to your enemy rather than having it in your own base. (A very old tactic, but people now a days seem to have forgotten it)
I this case it means picking the enemy units off as they go to their rally point, rather than waiting for the full wave to hit your base.

I don't agree with it. it's better to defend your base because you'd have the guards posts to help destroy the enemyes

[Zanderist]

Another tip is to bring the battle to your enemy rather than having it in your own base. (A very old tactic, but people now a days seem to have forgotten it)
I this case it means picking the enemy units off as they go to their rally point, rather than waiting for the full wave to hit your base.

I don't agree with it. it's better to defend your base because you'd have the guards posts to help destroy the enemyes

EMPs rock those Guard posts, and I lasted longer not wasting any money on defense.

I maybe had  5 lynxs outside my base witht he lights off.

I've learned that at night time with lights off I can ambush alot

[Hooman]

Guards posts can be pretty, but the general concensus is that guard posts are largely a joke in this game. You're almost always better off spending the money on units. Maybe early on in the game, if you get the hp upgrade, and combat chasis don't advance too quickly (or weapons), then maybe GPs are useful.

Take a look at their hitpoints though. They just don't compare to that of a tiger. Plus, the tiger has a dual turret, and GPs will only ever have single turrets. By late game, a single GP is so far outpowered by a single tiger that there is just no point in building them. The only way to properly defend your base is with units. Plus, it's much easier and faster to build and deploy units than a guard post. Having to deal with building structure kits, loading convecs, deploying the GP, and returning the convec to the SF is a lot more than building a unit and moving it where you want it. Especially considering how much micromanagement this game makes you do already.


Yes, I love GPs, they can make you base beautiful, and are strangely satisfying to build a nice wall of, but they just aren't worth it when you think of what you're getting out of the time and money spent on them. Go for units if you're going to find yourself in a fight.

Another reason why not to go for defense, is in a Last One Standing type of scenario, you simply can't win unless you attack. You can't destroy their base if you never leave yours. The best you can hope for is a draw, and since those don't happen, you pretty much resign yourself to defeat. That's not to say waste your units on pointless attacks, but rather plan on attacking.



I'm not sure if lights do anything to fool the computer. But hey, it can be fun practice.  



Oh, and additional reasons for not splitting scientists on research.... Little know fact, but the number of scientists you have assigned to a research task affects the efficiency of each scientist. It turns out that the more scientists you have assigned to a task, the more efficient each scientist will be. Here's a table I pulled out of the exe on how it works.


Edit: The numbers to the left are the max scientists you can assign to the research, and the numbers along the top are the number of assigned scientists.

    1  2  3  4  5  6  7  8  9  10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17
4:  7  9  11 13
5:  7  9  11 12 13
6:  7  9  10 11 12 13
7:  7  8  9  10 11 12 13
8:  7  8  9  10 11 12 12 13
9:  7  8  9  10 11 11 12 12 13
10: 7  8  9  10 11 11 12 12 12 13
11: 7  8  9  10 10 11 11 12 12 12 13
12: 7  8  9  10 10 11 11 11 12 12 12 13
13: 7  8  9  10 10 11 11 11 12 12 12 12 13
14: 7  8  9  10 10 11 11 11 11 12 12 12 12 13
15: 7  8  9  10 10 10 11 11 11 11 12 12 12 12 13
16: 7  8  9  9  10 10 10 11 11 11 11 12 12 12 12 13
17: 7  8  9  9  10 10 10 10 11 11 11 11 12 12 12 12 13
18: 7  8  9  9  9  10 10 10 10 11 11 11 11 12 12 12 12 13

As you can see, that's about 150% the research rate from each scientist if you've assigned enough to the task, as opposed to only 1.

Edit: Updated table. It was missing the last entry of each row.

[Sl0vi]

You should start tubing towards the beacon far off to the east right away, and set up a mining operation there. This will give you alot more ore. You will need to defend it alot tho, get EMP's and Railguns asap and mass produce them.

The AI's attacks are poorly coordinated, and it's easy to fight them off with lynx/EMP and lynx/Railgun's.

Guardposts are powerful with units to back them up, but are just a minor slowdown for the enemy on their own. Use your lynx to help the guardposts, if you have emps try to get as many enemy units disabled as possible, while trying not to take damage to your own.

Guardposts are definetly not garbage in this game if used right, I've played to many games against Tellaris to think that

[Hooman]

I guess the occasional GP might be useful, and maybe disheartening to a player that wants to attack, but I find they do little against a computer, or a determined player that isn't afraid of them.


EMP is definately useful for longer games and against other players, but I find if you play this level right, you can pretty much kill the computer before EMP is really available in any useful numbers. Just the laser lynx should do it for you. But yeah, if you're in a longer game, get EMP.

 

[Zanderist]

You know WHAT BULLs*** ( i'm sorry I had to say that)

BUT I was DOING GREAT ON NORMAL

I removed the Spaceport base first,

AND WHAT DO YOU KNOW

as I'm leveling out and making gains with my colony.

A GOD DAMN VORTEX COMES AND AN ODD TWIST OF FATE and targets my command center!!!!!!!!!!!

I'm just like pissed off at this
 

[Hooman]

LMAO!  :heh:

Well that happens sometimes. Just unlucky that one game. Sounds like you're progressing though. I'm sure the next game you play you'll manage it. It's very unlikely a vortex will do that twice in a row.
 

[Zanderist]

LMAO!  :heh:

Well that happens sometimes. Just unlucky that one game. Sounds like you're progressing though. I'm sure the next game you play you'll manage it. It's very unlikely a vortex will do that twice in a row.

Awwwhh Man I beat normal

I went on the offensive first, taking out this time the middle base or thier starting base, just needed 10 lynx and I blitz the CC!

then failed at removing the Space port base so went on defensive.

Towards the end of the game I had this type of defenseive line set up




I got to the point were I need my population up so I built like crazy and Got the hell off that planet.

Sadly I didn't get to remove Plymouth completely

[Hooman]

Wow, interesting setup. I usually don't have to worry about them attacking from the north. But I see there are lots of craters on the other side of your wall.

What kind of army did they build up after you took out their main base? I've always found that's where most units come from.

And how come you couldn't kill the other bases? The middle one is usually the strongest, and the others are built from scratch, so they can't really defend themselves well at the start. Did you run low on ore? Or did you lose all your units taking out the middle base?



Well, you got me interested in playing that level one more time. I beat it on hard, and completely wiped out Plymouth in the beginning of the game. I had some morale issue for a while though since I killed everything. You know, agridomes, residences, women and children.  :whistle:

I went for the base in the top left first, then in the top right, and then for the middle base. The two colony bases were killed before they had any defenses. Just had to deal with a few lynx spread around the map that got in my way. Then I sent everything towards the middle one. By then I had what was left of my army comming at them from the north, and the new lynxes I'd built comming at them from the south. Did it all with laser lynx. I hadn't even researched any other weapons by the time plymouth was wiped out.  

[Zanderist]

Well the type of units they had were tigers, In the PRG, Microwave, EMP, and panthers and lynxs in the stickyfoam and EMP they had spiders that went down to my south wall, which in fact was the one that got hit by missles, ( that's why there's a meteor defense in fact if I panned to the left you'd see the second one I had) They came from the remaining 2 bases.

Also if you damage that mining unit just enough (put in the red, they would not use it anymore (from what I saw after playing easy again)

The reason why you see walls out side the walls was to herd them to the point were I had first hit. sorta like an ohmaha beach set up

I ran low and the ores, so I set my funding to nothing but the defense,  I could of built up a small force on the side, but that would of taken all night. Plus how the lava made a bottle neck, I would actually have to go back through the Plymouth middle base to come on the back of that plymouth base.

The way I beat the middle base was as I had the units en route I ordered SL to have the  spped increase ready. you need a total of 10 lynxs, by the time I had taken out the CC I only had one lynx in the red, and 9 others on there way for the Spaceport, Some actually got destoryed by the lava because it was still flowing.


And the lava flow that blocks the quickest passage to the CC( their  first common ore mine Entrance) was I had to to come down from the furthest point of the lava flow, and then sneak my way into the base when they spotted me, I just clicked right on the CC. And got as close as possible to it so when they did kill one of my units they would also add to the  CC destruction. My heart was racing!

[Chandler]

I've finished this one (can't remember if it was easy or normal):

Built up a decent base with some defence first, not many vehicles.
Built up a massive offensive force (ALL Thor Tigers)
Built 6 extra convecs - loaded: Command Centre, Structure Factory, Vehicle Factory (x2), Thor's Hammer Guard Post (x2)

I moved in on their top base first (if you leave them long enough they build a base up there). Lined up all my tigers, and then had one move forward and attack a GP to draw their vech's out. MWAHAHA... anyway.

While i was forming the line, I had my convecs build their mini base just below it and started spawning more Thor's, and the SF to build a couple more GPs and then restock the convecs for my next move.

I attacked their main base from the north. The rest is history.

Edit: x@ = x2 B)

[Zanderist]

I've finished this one (can't remember if it was easy or normal):

Built up a decent base with some defence first, not many vehicles.
Built up a massive offensive force (ALL Thor Tigers)
Built 6 extra convecs - loaded: Command Centre, Structure Factory, Vehicle Factory (x2), Thor's Hammer Guard Post (x2)

I moved in on their top base first (if you leave them long enough they build a base up there). Lined up all my tigers, and then had one move forward and attack a GP to draw their vech's out. MWAHAHA... anyway.

While i was forming the line, I had my convecs build their mini base just below it and started spawning more Thor's, and the SF to build a couple more GPs and then restock the convecs for my next move.

I attacked their main base from the north. The rest is history.

Edit: x@ = x2 B)

That sounds like easy, because I do the same thing

[Sl0vi]

You sound like you have a constant ore problem, like I have pointed out before, tube your way to the beacon far of to the east. Build the mine and 3 smelters. Place the smelters so that the loading bay is as close as possible to the mine, and set 2 trucks on each smelter. No more, no less. Bring lots of defences! Do this and all your ore problems should be over

[Hooman]

Unless the mine to the east is a 1 bar, which it often is for me, at least on hard.  <_<

Plus, you sometimes don't have enough colonists to run those extra smelters.

But all that aside, it is possible to kill the computer well before expanding to that mine, even on hard. Just the 3 bar starter that gets killed by the lava, and the 1 bar are enough if you're quick enough. You can build more than enough laser lynx to take out the computer before you run out of money.
 

[PUNK_FOX]

When I play on normal, I don't kill'em, I leave them 4 fun.  the only thing I

leave 4'em is their CC, SF, VF, MHD's, and their Common ore Smelters. The weird

thing is that they still manage to build Panther's and Tiger's. :huh: