Outpost Universe Forums
Projects & Development => GORF => Hall of Fame => Topic started by: Combine Crusier on May 24, 2007, 08:49:00 AM
-
The idea of this is to produce a new potential form of transport so don't club me......Please! Since a snail has no legitamate wheel, track, or leg system it would be easier to armor (hence they have shells).
Snail
Stats: Plymouth / Eden
HP: 980
Armor: Very Heavy
Speed: Slugish (Very Slow)
FP: 2 weapons (On top of shell) -20% ROF (Due to shared components)
Ability: Has 2 sensor globes that allow for improved LOS
LOS: 7 tile radius
Common Ore: N/A
Rare Ore: N/A
3rd Ore: N/A
-
For the last time, unless it's capable of travelling on rough terrain, it won't work!!!
-
How exactly does it move then? I doubt a vehicle is going to have a muscular foot.
edit -- yes, I did research how snails moved before I posted that, because I couldn't remember. You need to do research as well before posting
-
Escargot anyone?
And I agree with hacker, before proposing ideas, make sure you have a rather strong knowledge of the concept you are talking about. Use google and and get some more knowledge about how snails move.
-
Yeah, I could image an awesome killing machine, laying waste to everything in it's path coming towards your base at 0.012 km/h :P
edit - there, that should be the correct pace :P
-
Yes, I know it moves via pulsing muscles. If you attach a minature dozer plow to the front of it, it would flatten the terrain enough for it to move across. By using a system that pulses like the muscles on a snail, you'd have to use a flexible but strong material like Kevlar renforced rubber on the part that will do this. In order to get the pulsing you'd simply have to use hydralics.
Forgive me, I'm only trying to explorer new forms of movement, that are realistic.
-
Such a motion would be highly impractical.
-
With that reasoning then, couldn't you just attach a dozer plow to a vehicle with wheels or tracks instead? Using hydraulics, or muscle wire, or whatever to basically drag a tank along the ground would be highly problematic and unreliable. (Think of something simple that uses hydraulics, like brakes in a car, and realize how many factors there are that could fail).
-
What if you had devices inside that would push down and back like a person pushing on a heavy box, and the person moved instead? You would have a system of cylinders inside the snail that would touch the bottom material where the muscular movement would be and have the cylinders push the slug forward by applying pressure to the ground behind and below the cylinders thus creating forward movement.
-
Isn't that almost the same thing as walking then? (Just the "feet" are concealed inside the body)
-
I think the important question here is "why?"
Why choose this form of locomotion over any other form?
Each type of movement is developed for a purpose, generally as a response to environment.
The lynx is on a chassis of flexible wheels because that is a simple way to go fast.
The tiger, dozer, and earthworker are on treads because they have to push or pull a great deal of weight, and need as much traction as possible even at the expense of speed.
Spiders and scorpions use legs to give them an advantage on rough terrain, at the cost of overall speed and durability.
What would be the advantages of a snail type of locomotion?
Try as I might I just can't think of any practical purpose for such a thing other than novelty, which is not a good reason. I just can't envision a situation in which it would be advantageous to move this way.
Hydraulic legs would give a similar advantage to treads, namely allowing the vehicle to dig its "feet" in and pull huge amounts of weight, but that is pretty small window of usefulness, and even then there are probably better vehicle designs for it.
In fact, I'm developing a sneaking suspicion that the only reason snails move the way they do is because they didn't evolve far enough to get any better equipment. :P
Always try to have at least some vision of how an idea will be a significant improvement over what already exists before voicing it. That goes for everywhere, not just this forum or the internet, but for life in general. People want to be able to immediately hear/see how their lives/situation could be made better by an idea you are proposing. It is not enough for the idea to be different, it also has to be something people would want for some reason.
-
The idea is to create a vehilce that has no visible weak spots.... the weakest part being only the very bottom that is always in contact with the ground... So this vehicle is capable of having heavier armor than any other present vehicle at the cost of speed. This basically makes it the equivilant to the King Tiger during WWII......
-
Well, how about this:
Make a tiger, but have armor plating extend down to the ground?
-
Well, how about this:
Make a tiger, but have armor plating extend down to the ground?
Great, I have to bulldoze a route flat to use them!
-
This basically makes it the equivilant to the King Tiger during WWII......
But this isn't World War II. This is war on another planet in a hostile environment. Just because it works on Earth doesn't mean it will work on another planet.
-
The other thing is, the bottom of the vehicle would undergo tremendous stress. (Basically it's like you're pulling part of the vehicle with a 'foot' and the rest of the underbody just scrapes along the ground with it).
As far as the durability of the locomotion system, should it get shot or whatever.. first of all, the vehicle isn't going to move very fast (it moves like a snail). Second of all, it's probably a lot more complex than a typical wheel / track system (if it does move like a snail you have complex hydraulic systems to move the 'foot'). Tracks are actually very reliable and pretty hard to destroy compared to other forms of transportation.
Finally I don't think that we really need to justify having a new locomotion system based on the durability of such. (Since a vehicle takes damage as a whole, not in parts unless this is likely to change in OP3).
-
... Agreed... Instead the Snail could use treads, but the armor would still be able to cover the entire area exposed to weapons fire.
-
Why would we want a Snail anyways? Who cares how it moves, it would look stupid in combat.
-
So what if it looks stupid it would be more difficult to destroy than a tiger due to the heavier armor and increased HP! Besides the Tiger doesn't look like a cat.... The snail vehicle would only have a shell and protected movement system like a snail.
-
Idea for the Maesis version of the snail
Hermit Crab
Stats: Maesis
HP: 980
Armor: Very Heavy
Speed:Very Slow
Legs: 4 legged
FP: 2 weapons (On top of shell) -10% ROF (Due to shared components)
Ability: Is legged there-for is effected less by terrain change
LOS: 7 tile radius
Common Ore: N/A
Rare Ore: N/A
3rd Ore: N/A
-
umm Combine just because i pulled off the Multiped units doesnt mean that every unit you make with legs is going to work.
Besides you just said this thing has more armor then a tiger and yes it will look stupid. A tiger doesnt have to look like a cat to be called a tiger. It could be because of its stature or the fact it owns all. But with the other units Lynx and Panther there is a simularity. Lynx are small agile cats Panthers are jungle cats but bigger then lynx and Tigers are large cats also found in the jungle/forest.
-
And if it has more armor than the Tiger, it moves even slower than the Tiger.
Nobody would want to build something called a "Snail" anyways. They'd take one look at the name and say "I bet that sucks or they'd give it a name like Ownage Snail-Shaped Robot".
P.S. This thing only has one gun I'm guessing?
-
They both have 2 guns.
-
This is starting to sound more like a heavily armored guard post. It will have too much wait to move and be too expensive anyways with all the armor.
-
Holy crap? I go away for a couple weeks due to work and this is the hottest topic on the forums?
-
Yep.
Get your ass back here, post some new models/renders, and that might change. :P
-
lol.
I'm a little surprised no one has mentioned the reavers from Starcraft. They made it work, but then Starcraft seemed to have more of a fantasy element to it than OP2.
Maybe what we need is a warthog. Or something that looks like a puma.... :P
-
Seeing as this post is still open I will not create a new unit topic.
I have a proposal for a dual weapon lynx.
Puma
Stats: Eden / Plymouth
HP: 480
Armor: Light
Speed:Fast
Transportation: 6 wheels
FP: 2 weapons: -20% ROF (Due to shared components)
Common Ore: N/A
Rare Ore: N/A
It would essentialy be a heavy fast attack vehicle with enough firepower to take other foes as long as it is evading their fire but gets toasted when it holds position. Hmm. More guns for less armor. IE less armor than an upgraded lynx.
-
Seeing as this post is still open I will not create a new unit topic.
I have a proposal for a dual weapon lynx.
Puma
Stats: Eden / Plymouth
HP: 480
Armor: Light
Speed:Fast
Transportation: 6 wheels
FP: 2 weapons: -20% ROF (Due to shared components)
Common Ore: N/A
Rare Ore: N/A
It would essentialy be a heavy fast attack vehicle with enough firepower to take other foes as long as it is evading their fire but gets toasted when it holds position. Hmm. More guns for less armor. IE less armor than an upgraded lynx.
No, no uberified units from my modification of Plymouth Cold War.
-
What??? Plymouth Cold War Puma's??? Have to play it I guess.
No wonder my multitek seemed so UBER!
-
Name theif :P
this idea isnt good there should only be one dual turret and that is the tiger.
-
What was the maximum number of turrets suggested for a weapon up 'till now?
Cause going on that principle.. why not make a 4-squared fortress with 3-4 guns on it and make it a guard post?
Although, for the sake of adding some military diversity... has there been at least 1 new chassis added?
-
I did actualy hear of a veichle that uses that type (rougfly) of locomotion to traverse the terain in the jungle, by using flex-lon(flexable teflon and a tons of micro-hooks that can be withdrawn into tiny "pores" and hydrolics going in a "wormy" motion.
and why 980 HP?
-
its best not to really question this idea. It wasnt really liked. I dont think the guy that made it up shows any more. oh well.
-
Oh really?
I do see that this topic is something that needs to be pitched in the fire... I'm not even going to bother explaining it any further, it's not like it is being implemented anyhow.
-
Oh really?
I do see that this topic is something that needs to be pitched in the fire... I'm not even going to bother explaining it any further, it's not like it is being implemented anyhow.
As long as you keep it in your heart... its still alive. It may be dumb as hell - but alive.
-
As long as you keep it in your heart... its still alive. It may be dumb as hell - but alive.
May be? Hmm, there shouldn't be any doubt here. ;)
Anyways, nice to see you again, Combine.
-
Yes. I moved then my computer began shutting itself off and the problems been narrowed down to three things hard drive, wall outlet, power strip. Quite frankly it's annoying when you're playing a game you can't save and your computer just shuts off.
-
Heh, out of boredom I read the whole thread :P
The idea in itself isn't so bad. The Belts/Tracks will always be the weakest part of the tiger/tank. If you had them armored the vehicle would be harder to disable.
Perhaps not such a good idea to create a new vehicle type, but could be an optional research. Increase HP/Armor but lose speed of the unit.
-
You should never have techs that downgrade a unit. You should only open up the possibility of a new option so the player can decide based on their current resources and situation what would be the most beneficial to build.
Besides, wouldn't such a large reduction in speed already be like it's been disabled?If a tank losing it's treads is such a bad thing, why would you ever design a tank that can barely move even before it gets hit.
-
You should never have techs that downgrade a unit. You should only open up the possibility of a new option so the player can decide based on their current resources and situation what would be the most beneficial to build.
Besides, wouldn't such a large reduction in speed already be like it's been disabled?If a tank losing it's treads is such a bad thing, why would you ever design a tank that can barely move even before it gets hit.
Give it a new name or something then ? Have something like "Armoured Tiger" etc appear in Vec fac.
Not exactly the same thing this, but you currently have somewhat the same thing in the game already with the Reinforced Vehicle Construction research (The one leading to tiger research). Here Cargo trucks get extra armour, but you have to have rare in order to build them. If you don't have or lose your rare it means your kinda messed up ?
I'm no expert on this field, but I think the reason tanks today are being developed with emphasis on speed is because of Aerial weaponry. A tank is no match for a airplane or helicopter. Thus it has to be fast to avoid being hit to easily.
In OP2/OP3 there are no aerial units (?), thus a heavily armed vehicle which can withstand a lot of enemy fire without taking too much damage or being disabled would certainly have it's advantages.
Only example I can come up with from the top of my head would be the Panther or Tiger tanks from Germany during 2nd World War. They were so heavily armed most shots from Allied forces would just be deflected or do minimal damage. Panthers and Tigers often served as spearheads in attacks on defense lines, or as mobile defense positions dug into the ground at strategic positions. Allied commanders usually preferred going in wide circles around these tanks instead of engaging them, or only attacked when they had an advantage in numbers and could just pummel the Panthers/Tigers from all sides until they broke down/got destroyed.
No point discussing the pro's and con's of old tanks I guess, but I just wanted to press the point about the Strategical Niche such a vehicle could potentially fill.
-
Yeah, just to be clear on this, I've always considered that cargo truck upgrade that makes them require rare ore to be a big mistake. I really think that part of the game should have been designed differently. I find the direct effects of that tech to be more detrimental than helpful actually. It's not like your cargo trucks are designed to spearhead attacks. They're usually fast enough to run from disasters, and the enchancement doesn't change their survivability significantly, even if they can't get away.