Author Topic: Digital Electronics Lab (Read 3347 times)

Eddy-B · « **on:** November 16, 2006, 03:40:04 PM »

Is there any people here involved in digital electronics ? I mean, like building things with 74xx series chips and stuff.

There is a program 'out there' called Digital Works. You can google for version 2.0, which is freeware. The current version is 3.0 which costs $99 for a single user licence. This is, although being a fairle good and usable program, it has some bugs and some things i don't find particularly handy.
I've taken it upon myself to write my own version of it, so if anyone is interrested in it, you can find simple progress reports on my website. I'll be needing some beta-testers also, when it is finished.

Feel free to respond.

dm-horus · « **Reply #1 on:** November 16, 2006, 07:13:45 PM »

Eddy, as always you are a much appreciated master at OPU.

You get 10 stars: **********

Im not studying anything like this, but I know aLOT of people who would be interested. I could even pass it around my uni to some people who would really like to get their hands on something like this. Keep us posted!

Hooman · « **Reply #2 on:** November 16, 2006, 08:48:40 PM »

I've used digilog and Logic Works. Both had slight limitations, but not too bad. Digilog is a free download. It runs under DOS (or a Windows DOS box), or a number of other systems. I used it mostly on a Sparc workstation. It's a little bit old though, and it kind of shows it. The user interface isn't exactly what most people are used to. In fact, I'm sort of reminded of a point and click version of vi.

Logic Works runs under windows. But the only way I know of getting it (legally) was to buy their book on the software which included the CD. It was about 100$.

Other ways of obtaining it that I've heard about, are zipping up the folder on the school's install, and just emailing the zip file home. I guess they didn't put much effort into copy protection.

Eddy-B · « **Reply #3 on:** November 17, 2006, 08:43:03 AM »

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Im not studying anything like this, but I know aLOT of people who would be interested. I could even pass it around my uni to some people who would really like to get their hands on something like this. Keep us posted!

This is interresting!
I'd like to have my work spread, so i could earn some more recognition.
It will probably stay freeware, with maybe a few limitations that i can take out in a paid version of Digital lab.

I'll keep you posted. For the meantime, you can check the website

Mez · « **Reply #4 on:** November 18, 2006, 01:45:05 PM »

Why don't they SSH into the uni server and run the software directly off the uni computers?

To answer the copy protection issue, acedemic and industry don't want to have to deal with entering licence codes etc. they pay a licence for x hundred computers to use the software and then want to put it into their images, having to reenter a load of licence codes everytime u reimage defeats the point of imaging in the first place!

Knowing your programs Eddy-B its going to be good. I can't promise to pass it round my uni, as our electronics lab software won't be compatible, and we can access our software via SSH anyway.

Eddy-B · « **Reply #5 on:** November 19, 2006, 03:54:07 PM »

That's cool. And i know about multi-user license keys.
If you can SSH or otherwise log into a server that has the software: yep, that works fine, if the program allows multiple instances to run (divided over different users), which Digital Lab will allow of course.

As for the program quality: i'm still doing the basics: i'm now down to making components being able to connect to one another. Internally everything is done non-visually: ports & wires are virtual, and the template system will produce a visual result. Since i don't want to convert each and every action from and to visual actions, everything is done abstract inside. There's just 1 single procedure (DrawCircuit) that will draw the entire circuit onto the screen. Each time something changes, this procedure is called to reflect those changes.
Basicly what i'm saying is: I myself have to work with the abstract classes instead of the visual representation, which is quite difficult to picture the end-result while coding, so it's progressing slowly now <_< ...
but there is progress B)

Eddy-B · « **Reply #6 on:** November 20, 2006, 06:40:47 AM »

I've been asking this question on an electronics forum as well:

What should be done with the user interface ?
I'm now creating a copy of the DW userinterface, so i have something to test with. I myself was thinking of something simular to the Visio interface, using a panel with all available (pre-defined & user-defined) macro's and then have to user drag them to the sheet.

Any input at this stage would be appreciated.

Mez · « **Reply #7 on:** November 20, 2006, 07:25:33 AM »

Thats the easiest way to do it,

The program we use at uni (Cadence) you select the pre-built circuit from a library (like a file explorer interface, (I guess you will be using menus) then you click on screen where you want it. The version i use allows you to place multiple of the same component by clicking repeatedly. I.e. there is always a copy of the template hovering with the mouse, untill you press Esc The other option I find usefull, is that clicking the right mouse button rotates the template by 90 degrees, very useful in circuit design!

You are talking about a click and drag feature, to use the multiple template placement it needs to be a click to select, then click where you want to place it.

Perhaps there should be an option to allow click + drag, or no drag, just click for placement.

What do you think of implementing a multiple placement feature. when using gates you often use multiple.

Leviathan · « **Reply #8 on:** November 20, 2006, 09:45:30 AM »

Sounds good

I do some electronics and maths at univ. This is interesting. I would also be happy to pass it out at univ and tell people about it when your ready and I'm sure you will have many beta testers and people willing to give you input.

Whats the link to the electronics forum thread where you have posted?

Personally I work with Philips 8051 (89C668 micro) at univ.

Why did you get started on this project?

Eddy-B · « **Reply #9 on:** November 20, 2006, 11:57:28 AM »

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Sounds good

I may implement both styles.
The way it works now is the way Mez is suggesting: select a port type by clicking its button from the toolbar which allows you to "paste" it just once and the tool turns back into a pointer/selection tool. If you SHIFT-click the toolbutton, then the button stays down, and you can paste in as many ports (of the selected type) until you select another tool button (another port, or the aoorw tool, or the wire tool or any other). I may also add the ESC key to return to the selection/arrow tool.

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I do some electronics and maths at univ. This is interesting. I would also be happy to pass it out at univ and tell people about it when your ready and I'm sure you will have many beta testers and people willing to give you input.

The more the merrier!

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Whats the link to the electronics forum thread where you have posted?

This IS the forum. The other one is a Dutch forum, so i believe you won't have any luck reading the threads there...
My own website has a small portion dedicated to DL (Digital Lab, as i called it): www.eddy-b.com/DigitalLab
I'm thinking about installing my own little forum into that folder, so people can add remarks & bugreports.

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Personally I work with Philips 8051 (89C668 micro) at univ.

I like Atmel's microcontrollers, and i have worked with Z80 and 6502 (= the wellknown C-64 processor).

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Why did you get started on this project?

I started it because i been looking for a good testing-tool for digital circuits. I hate building a circuit and spend lots of $$ only to find out it doesn't work the way i expected it to work. I really prefer testing things in a virtual environment, rather then have my PCBs be thrown into the trash. A PCB is not cheap!

I searched the internet, but could only come up with 1 program that does exactly what i want it to do: Digital Works. I downloaded version 2.0, which is freeware, only to find it has some bugs and a few MAJOR shortcomings. I've also donwloaded version 3.04, which is shareware, and can be registered for $99 for a single-user license. Apart from finding a key in some warez site, version 3 didn't add that much to the existing free version, so that's when i decided to start my own. This was 3 weeks ago.

It looks promising, and i estimate i'll have a full beta version ready in about 2 weeks from now, assuming i can keep spending a hour or 3 each day working on it.

Leviathan · « **Reply #10 on:** November 20, 2006, 04:16:59 PM »

Quality. I personally don't need to do much circuit design but I know a lot of people do and I'm sure it would be a very useful tool.

Eddy-B · « **Reply #11 on:** January 16, 2007, 02:14:53 PM »

I've picked up on the project again.
If anyone wants to be a guinnea pig, let me know

Hooman · « **Reply #12 on:** January 16, 2007, 08:58:08 PM »

I just can't stop myself, but what about HDL? (Hardware Description Language)

From what I hear, that's more likely to be used in industry, where as the graphical layout is more likely to be used in a teaching setting.

instigator · « **Reply #13 on:** January 17, 2007, 08:10:47 PM »

Its funny. My current classes surround the realm of electronic devices. I am certianly interested in this for the future. I work at my school so I have prime access to lab items. Me? Beta tester? Sure

TRIX Rabbit · « **Reply #14 on:** February 11, 2007, 03:52:15 PM »

I took Digital Electronics as a class last year in school. We used Electronics Workbench, or something. I'd love to help beta test or give some input. The Idea sounds great. I also have access to a lab, and the computers have a catalog of parts.

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Ro@m · « **Reply #15 on:** March 21, 2007, 03:13:19 AM »

Yeah,EWB is better,and if you want a serial and user name,just copy them from the splash screen from the school computer..... :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

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Author Topic: Digital Electronics Lab (Read 3347 times)