Multiplayer Game Speeds

[instigator]

Hey im with leeor_net. Sometimes the games aren't just long enough. I'll play you leeor! just pick the game speed:P. also, is there a way to build an option into the multi game setup screen that locks the game speed? like to go no higher than 6 for example. just a thought....

EDIT: wb levi!

[dm-horus]

does anyone here play homeworld 2? that game is similar to op2 in that it is a low-profile game, small community but with really great merits. the problem is that players reduce the game to how well one has their build order memorized. ive never found this fun. so i started making maps for the game using community-made dev tools. the object is to FORCE all players into a non-combat position. force all players to focus on building their base, not their rush build order. i know its fun to get the adrenaline from a fast-paced rush but alot of the truely great parts of op2 are lost in this activity. someone needs to make some custom maps that have a single major choke point so that nobody can easily speed an entire screen of tigers into an enemy base. there is no other way to prevent game-ending rushes than to but an obstacle in the way. unless we want to add features to the game (which i find impossible) that would physically prohibit tanks from moving across a specified area. Someone needs to experiment with lava flows and see if they can maybe create flood plains that fill with lava after a certain mark that create multiple choke points. something to deter rushes. does anyone remember the term "backstab" from the days of WON? for those of you who dont, the common practice was to set a mark to build til and then send out all your amassed forces and fight. most of the players around then would backstab by rushing you WAY before the previously specified mark. is this a practice that has survived to OPU?

[dm-horus]

i forgot to mention that im the "colony builder" around here. i hate rush games and will usually quit when i find out that is the gametype. i generally like playing for at least 4-5 hours and focus entirely on building a massive base. i think as though i have no opponent on the map and build as though i have nothing to worry about and i advise those im playing with to do the same. you ever want to play a match like this, pm me or find me in irc. im usually always there.

keep in mind tho, most people around here are used to rushes and if you monitor their base, youll notice their building choice seems to learn toward that of a rush game. if you get into a situation where you are unsure if your opponent is building all those veh facts "just in case" or if they are building up to attack, you might fall into a trap where you match their forces, they match yours and so on until you are so paranoid that you launch an attack when neither player planned or desired.

.... what im saying is, communicate with all opponents. be blunt and ask "hey, wtf are all those veh facts for?" or "no, i dont need my base trimmed by thors"

[spirit1flyer]

I play homeworld 2 "but I just have the demo right now" and so does Baikon and one other I think.


I have only  been able to play one game online of OP2 but I have always liked the games were you build for a long time then do small battles increasing the size of the fighting slowly until you are fighting for your life are something    

[dm-horus]

I play homeworld 2 "but I just have the demo right now" and so does Baikon and one other I think.


I have only  been able to play one game online of OP2 but I have always liked the games were you build for a long time then do small battles increasing the size of the fighting slowly until you are fighting for your life are something  

well then we should play sometime. im the king of long-winded games!

[spirit1flyer]

yea as soon as I get my router working we should do a game    

[thablkpanda]

Leeor- I'm right there with you man
Horus - Ditto

Haters - I don't hear ya'. I can't stand people that want to click a bazillion times per second, and own everyone. If I can have a huge-ass base, and be at the unit limit with my vehicles, and with mining outposts and stuff all over the map- that's cool IMO. I like the feel of owning a small town or whatever, It's hard to explain, but rush games get rid of all that. I mean the rush people around here seem to play games just to get it over with. When you sit through a 2-3 hour game and finally face-off your enemy with HUGE numbers of units in strategic locations, and with defense outposts built to defend your base, or vehicle factories built miles away from your base just to keep a constant flow of units in the battle, you can own a army of Hundreds (ok however many the unit limit is) of units, it's a cool feeling. Like driving a Maserati, just without the hundreds of horsepower.

You get the point- and if you don't, you don't have to- it's just cool.

Horus- we gotta play sometime.

Panda

[Hooman]

Baikon will hate me, but I played a colony game without him.  

It was kick ass.  (thumbsup) It's fun to dig in a build walls 3 tiles thick around most of your base. It's also fun to play with EMP missiles, although, probably not so much for the other person.  :whistle:

That, and I think I've come across a little secret about EMP, and it's possible destructive power, that I always thought didn't happen. I have yet to look into it yet though. (Idea based on some code I've seen). Still probably not all that useful though.  :unsure:

Btw, I hit both the building limit and the vehicle limit in that game. From the scores list at the end, I'd built less than 100 of each. But hey, it was a 4 player game.

Think I can use any more smilies?  (thumbsup)  :heh:    

[Kolaris]

Yeah, I completely agree. I've never played OP2 online but its like that for most Strategy games. I have the game speed way down and that helps a bit, but its always better to get someone of the same mind and ability to play with.  

[Sl0vi]

Unlike you ppl that love playing slow games, I just don't like being forced to wait until mark 1600 before anything starts happening. I've played games that have reached that mark and gone beyond, but usually because the game survived beyond the rush phase of the game.

There are some maps already where the games often turn out to last for a long time, mostly on big maps, people just need to learn how to survive in the early stages of the game.

As for game speed, I myself prefer having it at 6, unless ofcourse if someone is lagging It's not too slow, but you don't have to be a "super-clicker" either. And no annoying attack marks

[Sirbomber]

Problem solved. More or less.
I made a techtree that will prevent all rushing except scout rushing/etc. Just don't play with people that use those tactics though.  <_<

Anyways, it makes Laser/Mic research require a blank tech that you can't normally research. That way who(m?)ever is making the dll can set the mark that you get the tech at.

In other words, if I'm making a mission I can make it so you can't research Lasers/Mics (not even GPs) until mark X.

I thought it was a great idea, but tell me if I should bother making maps for it or not and what kind they should be (player #s, gametypes, maps used, etc.).

[Sl0vi]

yeah, that would just lead to a race of who can get most vec facs and mining operations going, so he can quickly storm the enemy at that mark. That's just a new kind of rush :/

Besides, I don't see why you should force an attack mark on people. I think most people that want to play with attack marks are quite capable of coming to an agreement themselves, and sticking to that agreement.

[Sirbomber]

Frankly, if you don't or can't understand it, you never will. You're stubborn and refuse to stray from the "philosophy" of "Whoever has the biggest guns by Mark 50 wins". But I'll explain anyways or you'll call me a/n (insert generic insult here).

If you can't research weapons then it isn't a rush to get the most weapons BEFORE the attack mark, it's a rush to get the most weapons after. The No-Weapons Research Mark allows people to have a more laid-back OP2 experience instead of the click-race we're all used to. If you can't research guns until mark 200 then it guarentees that you don't need to worry about getting attacked until then. Also, this way everybody starts out more balanced. It allows people who might not be good at getting scientists/etc more time to research things, allows them to get more ore, build more vec facs, etc. It gives people who might not be good at some aspects of the game to get a little more even with the better players. It reduces the race to click things faster than the other guy.Think: which is a better idea?

1) Normal AM - People spend all the money before the AM building lots of Lynx/etc and researching only what they need to get the best army. People rush to get ore, vec facs, etc. Little/no attention is payed to the large OP2 techtree if it doesn't get you guns, or better vecs, or lets you build thinngs faster, or get more ore, or train more people...

2) No-Weapons Mark - People can research non-weapons related techs and concentrate on building the colony and population. It would be great for games with morale on. People can concentrate on building reses and meds instead of building lots of guns. People can actually have VARIATIONS of build/research orders. People can build WHAT they want WHEN they want instead of the "pre-set" orders we all know. With the AM you still have to deal with that huge army your opponent has. With this, nobody can have any armies until everyone else can.

[Leviathan]

Sounds good

[Sl0vi]

I understand it, I never said I didn't. But unlike you, I just see it a little differently.

The thing is, when you reach that mark, it's all about researching the tech asap. Then mass producing units. Which also means, that the time before that mark is gonna be about getting as many vec facs and mining ops going as possible. So that you can just quickly outproduce your opponents. As I said, a new kind of rush, not a rush after weapons, but PRODUCTION.

Bases won't have any real defences either, because you couldn't research weapons, which means no GP's. This is possible in attack marked games, because players can research weapons tech. Well fortified bases are painful to crack, trust me, I've been playing against Tellaris alot lately, and he's very good at fortifying his base.

I only see this idea working in large maps, like ATW. Where simply the possible distance between the players, helps buy some extra time.

edit - By the way, you should try playing some unmarked games with morale on. You also get to research alot of techs you normally don't then.

[Arklon]

Morale steady/unsteady doesn't affect the research tree. Only affects production speed (morale fluctuations).

Newbies need to be able to develop an effective multiplayer strategy for themselves (reading a build order tutorial doesn't really help, they have to figure out exactly what to do, when to do it, and how to do it as quickly as possible), and they don't really get any chance when they're being blown to pieces when they've just started building an advanced lab.

[Sl0vi]

it doesn't affect the tech tree, but there are alot of techs based upon morale, that you have no need to research when it's turned off.

[HaXtOr]

Just wait untill I have all my tutorials finished. Then you can practice playing multi without the ego crushing effect of looseing to someone on irc

[Ezekel]

i forgot to mention that im the "colony builder" around here. i hate rush games and will usually quit when i find out that is the gametype. i generally like playing for at least 4-5 hours and focus entirely on building a massive base. i think as though i have no opponent on the map and build as though i have nothing to worry about and i advise those im playing with to do the same. you ever want to play a match like this, pm me or find me in irc. im usually always there.

keep in mind tho, most people around here are used to rushes and if you monitor their base, youll notice their building choice seems to learn toward that of a rush game. if you get into a situation where you are unsure if your opponent is building all those veh facts "just in case" or if they are building up to attack, you might fall into a trap where you match their forces, they match yours and so on until you are so paranoid that you launch an attack when neither player planned or desired.

.... what im saying is, communicate with all opponents. be blunt and ask "hey, wtf are all those veh facts for?" or "no, i dont need my base trimmed by thors"

just like the cold war.

each side ramps up to match a potential threat till it spins outta control