Author Topic: Outpost 2-LIKE game - Community Input requested  (Read 16750 times)

Offline lordpalandus

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Re: Outpost 2-LIKE game - Community Input requested
« Reply #200 on: March 07, 2017, 12:10:47 PM »
Thanks for the insight on how morale works, Hooman. I always thought that idling the nursery had a much greater impact than what is shown.

A valid point leeor_net. Though from several developer interviews of those giant corporations, they create a huge design document and then ignore it throughout most of the development process... at least that was the case with Diablo 3, Duke Nukem Forever, and Aliens: Colonial Marines... and see how well those turned out :P
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Offline lordpalandus

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Re: Outpost 2-LIKE game - Community Input requested
« Reply #201 on: May 21, 2017, 01:12:16 AM »
Sorry for the long delay, in replying. Turns out my idea needs a few more revisions. However, I am temporarily shelving this for later. Since its been almost over 2 years since I've started this project, and haven't made anything financially viable with it, and doesn't appear I will be anytime soon, I'm putting this on the backburner to focus on a different project.

I've been working on a text-based adventure for the past couple weeks, and honestly, I'm finding it much easier to code for and the code I have made for it, does what I want it to do. I've found making the text-adventure to be much more enjoyable and fulfilling than working on this remake. Probably because when I do run into a problem I can fix it and I actually understand what I'm doing. I feel confident that I will be able to make something financially viable with my text-based adventure and thus I've been just focusing on it lately. I'd be happy to share it once I've finished implementing a few more features, and get some feedback on it from people here. It has a fully functional combat system, that I designed and coded myself, a variety of items, and game failure states already put in. I'm really enjoying making the text adventure and it is showing a lot of promise for a very interesting game.

I'd like to do something with my Outpost 2 remake, but my finances have dwindled over the past 2 years, and I really need to either get a day job or focus on producing a game in an engine that I can actually use reliably and solve problems that I have with it, in a few days, rather than with UE4 having some problems take months to figure out. I'd like to return to this later, but right now I need to focus on my finances and I honestly don't think I can have an RTS produced within a year... whereas this text-based adventure, I can easily see it being completed within a year and have something unique that other text-based adventures don't have, and thus set it apart from other titles. As I've been busy with it, I kind of forgot about OPU, and thus this is why I'm replying now to give everyone a heads up. I'm sorry if this is a bit disappointing, but I've not made any money for the past 3-4 years, as I've been focused on designing and developing games, and thus I need something to change soon, or I'll have to leave game development, completely.
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Offline White Claw

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Re: Outpost 2-LIKE game - Community Input requested
« Reply #202 on: May 21, 2017, 02:41:54 PM »
No worries (at least not from me, anyway). Life is life, and taking care of yourself is certainly important. Game development is a hard industry, so good luck!

Offline Hooman

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Re: Outpost 2-LIKE game - Community Input requested
« Reply #203 on: May 22, 2017, 03:30:34 AM »
Hey lordpalandus, nice to hear from you.

Reading your concerns, I'd say take care of yourself first. Sounds like you already know what you need to do, so go ahead and go it. Guilt free.


As for making it producing games, don't feel you need to go all-in on a personal project with a make it or die trying mentality. I know there is a common mindset that you have to go all in to be successful. It turns out this is actually false. Statistically, the people who are the most successful at starting a business or completing some venture are not the ones that go all in, but rather the ones who maintain some day job to pay the bills while they work on their side project. Those who do transition to earning a living from their side project usually wait until it's already earning enough money to life off of, or even to replace their full time salary, and have reached a point where they just don't have the time to continue growing their side project and work full time. Both those conditions are important.

There are a few reasons to maintain a steady day job works better than going all in. One is the day job will force you to learn skills that may be very valuable to you in your own ventures. It's easy to push off future problems for another day, and never end up developing the skills for when you need them. The immediacy of a day job helps to combat that. Another big reason for having a day job is managing risk. If you rely on your side project for income, you won't be in a good position to take big risks with it, since failure has much bigger consequences. Having the security of a day job lets you experiment more and find out what works. It's those experiments that often lead to rapid growth and overall success.

Here's a gambling analogy. Lets say you gamble on something, winner takes all, with over 50% win ratio for you. This means the more you play, the more your should expect to win. The more you bet each round, the higher your expected earnings. Sounds good. Except for one problem. If you always bet everything, always going all in each time, your probability of going broke approaches certainty the more games you play (even with 99% win ratio). In other words, long term success doesn't generally follow a sequence of high stakes risks, even if each one is in your favour.


As for getting a day job, did you have any particular jobs in mind?

Offline lordpalandus

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Re: Outpost 2-LIKE game - Community Input requested
« Reply #204 on: May 26, 2017, 01:23:43 PM »
Less a day job, and more a project-focus change, Hooman. I believe I can make the text adventure marketable within 6 months tops, as I'm progressing quite rapidly at it. I have a variety of features in mind that will set it apart from the usual text-adventure or non-visual novel and thus ensure that it can be sold. There does seem to be people interested in playing text-based adventures, but the question will be whether people are willing to PAY for one. But, I'll look into that issue later; for now, just work on it and once its in a playable state, get feedback on it.
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Offline Hooman

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Re: Outpost 2-LIKE game - Community Input requested
« Reply #205 on: May 26, 2017, 03:07:03 PM »
There are ways to test a market before producing the product. I'd highly recommend looking into it. It's much better for you to test up front, than to potentially waste 6 months on something that nobody wants. It also lets you tweak the direction if you realize what people want is just slightly different. That takes considerably less effort the sooner in the development cycle you catch it.

One of the most common reasons for not testing the market, is not realizing you can do it before developing a product, or not knowing how to do it. It's very easy to push something off if you don't know how. It's uncomfortable. Deal with it later. Though avoiding the uncomfortable things is often setting yourself up for trouble.

Another reason for not testing the market, is people object to some of the methods presented. There are many ways to do it, so choose something that works for you. Indeed, you'll often come across some very sleazy sounding tactics, like putting up a page to sell the product, and measuring how many people buy, even though you don't yet have a product to give them. This can actually be illegal in some places, especially if you're actually collecting the money. A softer variant of that is to have a buy button, but rather than going through order completion, it informs the user the product is not ready yet, and the expected release date. Knowing how many people see the page, and how many people click the "buy" button, would then give an indication of market demand, both in terms of raw numbers, and percentage conversion rate. Though keep in mind not everyone that clicks "buy" would necessarily have completed the order even in the case where there was a product to sell. This method might still seem misleading, since you're getting users to click a "buy" button, when it's impossible to actually buy. A softer method still might be to have a "learn more" button, that gives more details of your game, and the date it's expected to be released. There are other tactics as well. Some might involve leaving an email signup for people who want to be informed when the game is released. This is likely to provide a better estimate of demand than simple page clicks to learn more, since some people like to look around with no intention to buy. It also helps filter for people who are willing to take action towards your product, which is a very good sign.

Offline leeor_net

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Re: Outpost 2-LIKE game - Community Input requested
« Reply #206 on: May 27, 2017, 12:03:51 AM »
... at least that was the case with Diablo 3, Duke Nukem Forever, and Aliens: Colonial Marines... and see how well those turned out :P

We don't speak of Duke Nukem Forever.

Ever.

Also, you're not building a project with a multi-million dollar budget with hundreds of developers so I think it's safe to say my point stands. :D

Offline Sirbomber

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Re: Outpost 2-LIKE game - Community Input requested
« Reply #207 on: May 27, 2017, 06:15:22 AM »
Now I'll come right out and say I don't know what I'm talking about.  But, if you want to make game development your career path, perhaps it would be better for you to make something for yourself, something you and your friends would find fun, rather than something to generate income (not that it can't do that too, fingers crossed).  But you could then use that to build your resume and hopefully land a job where you can meet people you can learn from, and get some training and experience.  That might be a better launchpad for your career.  But I'm sure someone else will come along and correct me if I'm steering you in a bad direction.
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Offline Hooman

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Re: Outpost 2-LIKE game - Community Input requested
« Reply #208 on: May 27, 2017, 08:54:19 AM »
Yes, I think finding a suitable job is probably the best thing you can do right now. That could open a lot of doors for the future.