Author Topic: OP2 Update Wishlist  (Read 8619 times)

Offline BlackBox

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« on: October 19, 2004, 03:59:10 PM »
Here, you can post your wishes on what you want us to add to the game in the upcoming updates.

Any reasonable suggestion is possible that you think we could do in a reasonable amount of time ("make your units totally invisible on the map" isn't too reasonable, but things like "add more landrush maps" are).

We probably won't be able to get to all of them right away, but post them anyway.

It's everyone's game, so tell us what you want to see.

-- op2hacker

Offline Tellaris

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« Reply #1 on: October 19, 2004, 04:31:44 PM »
-Another world map
-More Landrush maps :P
-Make speed upgrade for tigers reserchable if you retrieve the wreckage on Flood Plain
-More maps with said wreckage
-Better Editor (this would be a long project)
-An AI that can play ANY map.   (Again, a very long project)
-Maybe add capeablility to play with 8 players rather then 6
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Offline Hooman

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« Reply #2 on: October 19, 2004, 06:56:02 PM »
Mmmm, wishful thinking.  :)


More styles of gameplay. Make every way you can die in OP2 count for something.  :P
I'll second a better editor. We need one for the lazy map makers like me.  :D
More levels with Wreckage! (I've got one made already that's playable, maybe needs a little more work though)
A level with enough wreckage for everyone! (It's do-able)
A way to play landrush without having tons of convecs sitting around afterwards.
I'll second an AI that can play any map. (Existing or New only? I'm kinda working on something that's showing some promise for new levels and might someday have the possibility of adding it to old levels, but that's a really long way off)

I'm not sure it's reasonable to have 8 players instead of 6 players. The location of the internal player array is at a fixed location in memory and I'm pretty sure there isn't blank space after it. Same with the exported _Player array. I can't think of any reasonable workaround hacks for this one.

Oh, and the Tiger Speed Modification is "researched" as soon as you unload the cargo truck. There is no need to research it.

How about more secret techs to get from wreckage? I'm fairly sure they could be made.

A better shell! It takes way too many clicks to start a multiplayer game. Plus if you make a mistake you have to cancel and go back menus. Why not have a menu with more options on it so this isn't a problem? Also, wouldn't it be nice to add more multiplayer options to the pregame setup? Maybe have a DLL specific area. (But this would be a very large project and probably not very reasonable.)

Related to the above: Make the sheets selectable, so you can play with different sets of rules. (Again, not very reasonable.)

Mmmm, game server like WON. (*sigh* sadly a very huge project, but it *might* be doable given enough time.)

Anyone else come to the conclusion that it'd probably be easier to add all the "features" we want if we just remade the game? But again, not very reasonable, at least not in terms of time. Oh well, more wishful thinking from other people now.  :P

 

Offline Tellaris

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« Reply #3 on: October 19, 2004, 07:06:05 PM »
I mean make it so the speed upgrade has to be reserched.
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Offline HaXtOr

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« Reply #4 on: October 23, 2004, 11:51:42 AM »
Some sort of fire napaml weapon!
 

Offline BlackBox

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« Reply #5 on: October 23, 2004, 12:10:06 PM »
Haxtor, I think I mentioned "reasonable" in what you could and couldn't think of. (Adding stuff like that would be very hard. and you'd need to create new graphics, which is unreasonable).

I don't think making sheets and other stuff selectable, etc is hard.

The tiger speed mod needing to be researched is totally possible, too.
 

Offline PlayingOutpost0-24

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« Reply #6 on: October 23, 2004, 12:47:01 PM »
well then 8 players... we only have colors for 7, no?
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Offline HaXtOr

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« Reply #7 on: October 23, 2004, 11:59:20 PM »
ok i want to be abble tp build scorpions that have a thors hammer on board or acid cloud, i ahev done this in dll so it is possible. also you can have a scorpion with a disateruious explotion onboard that blows up biger then a supernova.

Offline PlayingOutpost0-24

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« Reply #8 on: October 24, 2004, 02:57:04 AM »
Haxtor, having thor or acid scorpion is impossible in game. Scorpion is a plymouth development, while Thor and Acid is Eden.
btw in the way of selecting sheets we could play FULLTECH at last...


is there a way to add new game modes?
« Last Edit: October 24, 2004, 02:59:47 AM by PlayingOutpost0-24 »
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Offline Hooman

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« Reply #9 on: October 24, 2004, 03:55:05 AM »
Quote
"make your units totally invisible on the map" isn't too reasonable

Umm, you're not gonna believe this, but... I just found an invisibility flag on the units. I've made a vehicle factory invisible. It still works perfectly. The only thing you can see is the active/disabled light (which your enemy can't see) and of course the selection box when you click on it. Mind you, the bulldozed terrain, the tubes, and the units popping out of it kinda give it away.

Anyways, so far it doesn't seem to work for vehicles, just the buildings. I also had it non targetable for a little while (one of the other flags), but I couldn't control it either.


The speed upgrade needing research seems fairly easy. Were you thinking to make it always researchable or only researchable if you get wreckage?

Allowing for 7 players *might* be possible but 8 is quite unreasonable. Mind you it looks like having 7 players could be pretty difficult. I'm not really sure how to go about doing it. For one, the multiplayer pregame setup dialog would need changing to make room for a seventh player. Probably a few other user interface issues and possibly some error checking code here and there could get in the way. It might actually work for 7 players though since it already has room for 7 internally (probably an extra one for a computer opponent). Anyways, it looks like it might require some shell changes so I don't really consider it all that reasonable. At least for now.

Scorpions with disasterous building explosions on them could be kinda cool, but probably better kept to specialty maps. I would prefer sticking with the original sheets except maybe for specialty maps, which for now means only modified tech trees. Having selectable sheets would be cool, I wouldn't mind having alternate rules then, but I'd like to always be able to play with the originals. Anyways, I see having selectable sheets as a shell modification. Is there an easier way Hacker?
 

Offline PlayingOutpost0-24

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« Reply #10 on: October 24, 2004, 05:25:15 AM »
i know this is unreasonable but i had some wild map ideas from WC3 for OP2 but all i think would need custom units... i know its a long time to figure out and etc., but if there is a way (that is not TOO challenging) then lemme know.

to Hooman, that light disappeared after a while, dunno y
« Last Edit: October 24, 2004, 05:26:39 AM by PlayingOutpost0-24 »
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Offline HaXtOr

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« Reply #11 on: October 24, 2004, 10:09:53 AM »
Quote
Haxtor, having thor or acid scorpion is impossible in game. Scorpion is a plymouth development, while Thor and Acid is Eden.
btw in the way of selecting sheets we could play FULLTECH at last...


is there a way to add new game modes?
Ok it isnt impossible you can have eden weaponds with plymoth i have done it many times by mistake wiht makeing my own dlls. it is just the sheets that need to be modifyed so you can build the scorpions with the desired weapon on board. FYI you can put any weapon available in game on a scorpion and not crash the game. It adds a new rush technique because scorpions cannot be emped

Offline TH300

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« Reply #12 on: October 24, 2004, 12:59:46 PM »
Don't change too much in op2. You could ruin the game.

If you're going to make scorpions with normal weapons available, do it so that one has to research it after getting some wrackage (as for the tiger speed boost). This way map designer can decide if this technologie will be available on his/her map.
But never make eden-only-weapons available for plymouth or vice versa.

Offline Tellaris

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« Reply #13 on: October 29, 2004, 08:32:29 PM »
The speed upgrade needing research seems fairly easy. Were you thinking to make it always researchable or only researchable if you get wreckage?

I mean, make it so that after you get the wreckage, you then have to reserch the speed upgrade.   Make it long, along the lines of 1600 points (about the amount required to reserch spaceship tech)

GAME TYPE IDEA

Name:
"Run for your life!"
Most likely a long game.

Objectives:
Launch all spaceship modules (list them.   Ex Habit Ring, Fusion Drives)
Launch Pheonix Module
Launch Food Module
Launch Rare Metals Module
Launch Common Metals Module
Launch Evacuation Module (available after food, rare, and common modules have been launched.   Evac cannot be launched until colony population reaches 200)

Map size required:
Takes place on World maps only, others are most likely too small.

How it works:
All players start fairly near eachother.   An Advanced lab starts between them (can be player 1, or AI, or player 2, whatever, dosn't really matter.   Add a Tokamak to power the Advanced Lab, very close to it.   A cc is required, and can powe the Advanced Lab.) and they are on an open stretch of land.   This is basically landrush, they start with everything they need to start a new colony.   6 beacons nearby, for all players.   Morale drops off at start. (if enabled.   Disasters MUST be on for this to work correctly!) At roughly mark 250, a anouncement is said.   "THE BLIGHT IS APPROACHING!".   The Advanced lab is the starting infected spot.   You can even make it so that the blight has to be reserched, and all other reserch is disabled until the blight is reserched.   The blight spreads over the area, consumeing any nearby player bases.   It moves very slowly on the map.   VERY slowly. (rate of maybe one square every 25-50 marks.   Might even be able to go as low as 10.)
The players most run away, build and reserch.   The objective:   Escape the doomed planet (New Terra).   Eventually they start running off into space.   First person to leave the planet, wins.   Make lots of beacons everywhere.   Singles, dubbles, tripples.   The ore should be fairly abundent.   Cliffs, orange, grey, black ground.

Starting Discription:
After running away from the blight the first time, the players are able to only build a Basic Lab.   Residences, CC, SF, Smelters, Common Storage, Tokamaks are the only things available other then the basic lab.   They must reserch the starting 4 techs, Chemistry, Boptronics, and the other 2 or 3 ish.   After this reserch has been completed, Standard labs are available.   From there, players play as normal.
(Note: This is when the first CC is built)
(Note: Start is similar to that of landrush, all structures loaded into convecs)

Extras that I think should be in there:
ALL disasters.   You name it, should be there.   Meteors, Vortexs, Volcanic Eruptions (maybe one or two small ones, and a largeish one) Lightning Storms.   Volcanic spread should be fairly slow as well, so no player is quickly wasted.
Maybe some ares designed to look like some landforms in the main game campaign.   EX Plymouth Mission 2, Eden Mission 3, ect.   Shouldn't be too many spots, can really mess up the map.
Plenty of cliffs to be in the way.   Blight growth rate should be slowed on these, so players can kinda "Hide" behind them.    If possible, growth rate should be slightly faster during day then night (unless this is already built in)   Obviously Eden would have a bit of an advantage, with their Microbe Walls.

Neat possible features:
Blight grows faster on some land areas then others.   EX slower on orange then grey (if this isn't automatic)
An Automatic warning that the blight is approaching whenever it gets close to a player's base.
Objective to have enough evac transports for your population.   Players start with roughly 3 or 4 evacs, (75-100 population space)   Each evac can hold 25 people, so not an insane requirement.   A population of 200 requires 8 evacs.   Population of 300 requires 12.
How the evac requirement would work:   If this objective is NOT filled, and your last CC gets wasted, you lose.   I don't know how to do this, maybe make all player vehicles self destruct?   Or make them unable to control their vehicles?

What this basically is:
A multiplayer version of the single player campaign.

MAJOR REQUIREMENT:
If morale is on, a major change needs to be made.
Currently, any building that is infected to the blight does not aid your colony in any way, but IS added to the Disabled Bldg ratio.   This negatively affects morale.   Plus the "Structures Disabled" message gets annoying.   This will have to be somehow disabled, hopefully it isn't hard coded into the game.   Otherwise, morale will be impossible on this map.
The only other solution I can think of is making the blight insta kill buildings.   Not as cool looking, but it does work.
Another possible problem is that these buildings would somehow have to not be included in a player's structure limit, or they could quite quickly run into problems.

More then 2 players would be nice...

Thats all I can think of.   Comments anyone?
« Last Edit: October 29, 2004, 08:52:25 PM by Baikon »
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Offline PlayingOutpost0-24

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« Reply #14 on: October 30, 2004, 06:57:06 AM »
Quote
Ok it isnt impossible you can have eden weaponds with plymoth i have done it many times by mistake wiht makeing my own dlls. it is just the sheets that need to be modifyed so you can build the scorpions with the desired weapon on board. FYI you can put any weapon available in game on a scorpion and not crash the game. It adds a new rush technique because scorpions cannot be emped

Haxtor i meant in "normal" game... of course, sheets edited, dll hacked, etc it is possible


Quote
Don't change too much in op2. You could ruin the game.

If you're going to make scorpions with normal weapons available, do it so that one has to research it after getting some wrackage (as for the tiger speed boost). This way map designer can decide if this technologie will be available on his/her map.
But never make eden-only-weapons available for plymouth or vice versa.

SELECTABLE SHEETS? SHEETS ONLY FOR MAPS? IS THAT ENOUGH?
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Offline TH300

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« Reply #15 on: October 30, 2004, 02:22:46 PM »
Quote
SELECTABLE SHEETS? SHEETS ONLY FOR MAPS? IS THAT ENOUGH?
enough for ?

I'm not sure about what you want to tell me. But the only thing that matters is whether you change something in op2 or not. Selectable sheets wouldn't be a way to remove any changes. It could become so that one either has to accept the changes or won't be able to play. It would at least split the community into many parts which all prefer different setups of the game.
I believe you want to make a new warcraft out of op2. If so, you should better change another or make a completely new game.

And please don't shout at me.



Baikon:

Great idea. I'd most obviously play that scenario.
A solution for the inactive-buildings-problem could be to make infected structures no longer belong to the player but to the ai (as in the single player campeign mission 4)

Offline Hooman

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« Reply #16 on: October 30, 2004, 04:41:32 PM »
For the selectable sheets idea, there are two ways I see possible. One is to allow 1 specific level to have it's designer choose to use an alternate set of sheets. This would not affect any other levels, particularly the ones already made. The other way I was thinking, was to have multiple sets of sheets available for all levels. But then the default set of sheets should always be an option, so you'll always be able to play with the original rules.

I'm actually rather against chaning the game. At least in the sense that you can't play by the original rules.

So yeah, those updates that took the tubes away from GPs and allowed Evacuation Transports to be built in multiplayer, I don't think should really be there. At least not replacing the original rules the way they did. I wouldn't mind it being an option, maybe set by the game creator, or a level designer. Then people can choose to not play that level, or not play a game where the creator wants to use different rules.
« Last Edit: October 30, 2004, 04:42:06 PM by Hooman »

Offline Tellaris

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« Reply #17 on: October 30, 2004, 05:21:55 PM »
I think Guardposts should have their tubes back....    Screws over any AI base in the default games, they don't compensate for the removal.   I don't mind Evac Transports being available though.
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Offline Leviathan

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« Reply #18 on: October 31, 2004, 03:08:30 AM »
Quote
Don't change too much in op2. You could ruin the game.
We should develop a new op2 and leave op2 how it is.
edit researsh, weps, units etc 2 make a game which works differently from op2. i havent spent much time on my mod yet. id like 2 make both teams different but even. i was thinking for researsh you would tech up in levels like on AOE/DoW, u would have 2 research some stuff each time then u could level up a tech level.

Offline PlayingOutpost0-24

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« Reply #19 on: October 31, 2004, 12:18:07 PM »
now i say: selectable OP2.. when the game starts it will ask if op2 or modded op2 u wanna run.
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Offline Mez

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« Reply #20 on: November 03, 2004, 10:42:40 AM »
Yes definatly
Quote
now i say: selectable OP2.. when the game starts it will ask if op2 or modded op2 u wanna run.

Im fed up of starting a coloney game and half way through finding that the vech fact only needs 2 workers to operate etc...  I keep find changes that i dont want there.

Offline Betaray

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« Reply #21 on: November 04, 2004, 06:50:57 PM »
I know this would be extremly hard, but ill throw it out anyway

remember that robo/seed coloney ive been preaching about for years, that lol
I am the nincompoop, I eat atomic bombs for breakfest, fusion bombs for lunch, and anti-matter bombs for dinner

I just hope they don't explode

Offline PlayingOutpost0-24

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« Reply #22 on: November 05, 2004, 10:08:23 AM »
Beta, as soon as creating new units will be figured out i create a Unit Editor, okay? then u can do ur thingy...
Great news for OP2 fans... OP3 in progress.
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Outpost 3: A New Power progress
OP3:NP Discussion

Progress in OP3:NP[/size][/font]
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Offline Tellaris

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« Reply #23 on: November 06, 2004, 05:55:16 PM »
Yes, I want to be able to play the game with the original settings in place.
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Offline Mez

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« Reply #24 on: November 08, 2004, 03:02:32 PM »
I think we need the solution where the original compressed sheets.vol is part of the current op2 v 1.3.1 i.e. an unmodded original copy.  hen there should be say op2.5 the modded version this way the two games are idfferent and cant be played with in multiplayer against the other version due to a completly diffrent checksum.

yes this would mean more downloading and two copies of op2 but it would solve quite alot of problems that i had about 2 months agowith different mods of op2 and checksum errors between different players as no one quite knew what version they had or should have.

may be even what baikon said about selecting between 2 the two versions at startup - but again that would involve alot of programming and more unwanted updates by some people who dont want to have anything to do with a modded version of op2 cos they like the original how it is.

Please bear in mind that im not trying to offend anyone who has put in alot of hard work to acheive the two versions, as it is execllent that so much has been learnt about how the game works through this modding of it.  i for one however think that it has progressed so far and well that it deserves to have its own distro so different people can appreciate the original and the modded version without too mush hassle.