Outpost Universe Forums
Projects & Development => Projects => Other Projects => Topic started by: Leviathan on October 07, 2015, 11:46:42 PM
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Hi all,
A few of us have been talking and would really like to restart the wiki and get documentation done for the Outpost 2 internals and SDK/API. There is some talk in other threads but I will start a new one for discussion on moving forward with it.
Current plans are to use Doxygen for creating a reference manual to the code and also having a website wiki that everyone can contribute to.
We will scale back what the original wiki was and not include unnecessary pages.
wiki.outpost2.net (https://wiki.outpost2.net)
:)
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Okay, so gist of this is that we're rebuilding the wiki using a much more recent version of a major wiki platform. We've settled on DokuWiki for several reasons that are beyond the scope of this thread but suffice it to say that it does exactly what we need it to do, it's amazing and you should go register right now!
https://wiki.outpost2.net/
We want to take what the original wiki wanted to be and actually make the new wiki be that; A definitive and comprehensive collection of articles and documentation for everything Outpost, Outpost 2 and Outpost Universe.
Main Category Listing
- Outpost 1
- Outpost 2
- OP2 API Tutorials
- OPU Projects
- Main Projects
- Active Community Projects
- Inactive Community Projects
This isn't a comprehensive list, it's just what I had off the top of my head so this is going to change as we move forward and further develop this project.
From these categories we'll be breaking things down into sub-categories and so on. Those of you familiar with MediaWiki's category system should take note that in DokuWiki, Namespaces provide the same functionality. In the context of this thread and our Wiki, Namespace and Category are interchangeable.
Sister Project
We've been talking about updating the documentation for the Outpost 2 SDK (https://forum.outpost2.net/index.php/topic,5427.0.html) to use Doxygen syntax so we can automatically generate a static HTML 'manual' for it. This will be a useful reference for those who are already familiar with the API and are just looking for a quick reference without having to dig through the source code.
In addition to the manual, we want to provide tutorials and additional documentation about the how's and why's of things in the SDK much like many libraries (such as SFML, SDL, NAS2D and OGRE3D do) and that's where the Wiki comes in. This is where we go over the finer points and nuances of the SDK, how to use it effectively, tips, suggestions and caveats.
Goals
To provide a comprehensive guide to Outpost, Outpost 2, Outpost Universe, OPU's many projects (both active and inactive) and the OP2 SDK.
How You Can Help
Register for the Wiki and start writing!
Migrating from the old Wiki
A lot of the information on the original Wiki is good to go. You can help by migrating the information that's already there. The markup between the two Wiki's is a little different but even just copy/pasting the source from the old wiki to the new wiki will be helpful.
Outpost 2 SDK
If you're familiar with the Outpost 2 SDK and you want to help write the tutorials (I think there may even be a number of them in actual forum posts as well), go ahead and start writing!
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This is looking interesting ! I think I'll give some screenshots and provide the Wiki.
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Woot! Would love some help. I got started yesterday on some basics.
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Here are the links showing all the pages on the old and new wiki:
Old:http://www.outpost2.net/oldwiki/Special:Allpages (https://www.outpost2.net/oldwiki/Special:Allpages)
New: wiki.outpost2.net/sitemap (https://wiki.outpost2.net/doku.php?id=start&do=index)
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Hey guys, some of you have started writing some of the pages on the new wiki and they're all great starts! Thanks for the help guys!
I've unfortunately not been able to do as much as I'd like. Been kinda busy with real life stuff and developing OutpostHD.
But I haven't forgotten about the project.
We should consider some of what Sirbomber talked about in the following thread: https://forum.outpost2.net/index.php/topic,4141.0.html
Basically, we want to avoid having a lot of articles that aren't really worth having. That's kind of vague, I know, but any questions or suggestions should probably be brought up in this thread.
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Anybody on top of this? I could probably donate some time, and on that note how difficult is it to migrate and create in the new wiki?
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There isn't anybody 'in charge' so to speak. Or anybody really directing it.
We're using DokuWiki now so the markup is similar to MediaWiki but there are significant differences.
I don't know how much of the original wiki needs to be moved over. A lot of it can probably be dumped but there's also a lot of useful information as well.
As stated on IRC, I have a long weekend coming up so I'll probably have some time this weekend to do some work moving over some of the useful information.
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Yeah man. Giver.
I have time to help is all I'm saying.
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Turns out I spent most of my long weekend driving so I had no chance to do anything with the Wiki.
However, I've been looking over the original wiki and there's a LOT of great information if you sift through the fluff.
We've got our work cut out for us.
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Okay, I started on this, made some mistakes, got it corrected. I am going to use what I can from the old wiki, just shorten some of the explanations, cleanup others and compile it a little neater and cleaner than what was there.
So far I started on the OP2 Online Manual section with a link to a new page for Units (buildings and vehicles)
I originally started something different, than looked at the old wiki, realized what I was doing was dumb and started over. So if you see in the recent changes something deleted, that was something I made.
Now that I have got my first mistake out of the way I could use some tips or pointers, or if its garbage delete it and I'll move on.
Thoughts? Suggestions?
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Alright.
With a little help from Leeor I got the Unit Reference page for Buildings and Structures completed as part of the OP2 Online Manual.
I figure i'm missing at least one or two things, probably adjust sizes here and there. And I am going to add a small subsection to the spaceport on that page under the spaceport for components and pricing that are manufactured by the spaceport rather than making a whole page for just that, or should I?
- NOTE - If anyone could get me the passkey to be able to delete a media file or two, there was at least one incidence where the file name made for a bad transition onto the wiki. Be much abliged. (there is a double copy of the plymouth dirt structure, the first i uploaded as plymouth_d.i.r.t.png and yes that was dumb the next was just plymouth_dirt.png much simpler.
If anyone has any suggestions on where in depth descriptions of each building should go I'm all ears. Just trying not to clutter up pages or add unneccessary items.
David R.V.
EDIT - yes, I forgot the Forum structure. I'll remedy that when I get home.
Edit.Edit Forum added.
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I just took a quick look at the page for structures. The images are nice.
I noticed a few oddities:
- the different sized images for the light towers
- the tube going to the MHD Generator
- mines for only one colony, and unsurveyed
Another thought I had, was the two colonies sometimes have corresponding structures, but with a slightly different name. Should these somehow be lined up? I was thinking of the Forum/Rec Center, and the Advanced Residence/Reinforced Residence. I realize of course there may be different resource requirements, and this also breaks the alphabetical ordering. Of course it might make more sense to arrange things based on use, and perhaps just have an alphabetical index available.
I'm surprised how well the images are lined up. I thought I remember reading you were doing this by hand using in-game screenshots. That's quite a few images to do manually. Perhaps we could discuss an automated way to generate images? I just dug up the old VB project for viewing game graphics and added it to SVN. Maybe we can make a tool to automatically extract images you need.
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Yes absolutely, if there was a simpler way to extract images I am all for it.
I was mentioning to Leeor or someone, I just used the snipping tool in Windows, it creates a png file that loads easily into the wiki, but as they are all in game pics I have to manually grid select the box size of the image when using that snipping tool, and once it is uploaded I just code the adjacent images to the same size. So both advanced labs are wrote in as {{eden_advanced_lab.png?150x150}} {{plymouth_advanced_lab.png?150x150}} the 150x150 just rescales the image to fit as a 150x150 pixel image.
- I don't completely like it as each image has that damn Active/idle light in the corner.
- Anyways, if someone could get me a image extracter and also the in wiki pass to be able to delete media once I have better images I can clean up that page and any corresponding pages I make. Also, having an extracter that could be adapted to pull images from the original Outpost might be helpful as well, and I could get all structure images without the damn indicator light
- And I was just about to say both colonies use the same mines but I am very much wrong there. I'll fix that. As far as surveyed or unsurveyed that could be in a another part of the tutorials defining mine output per bar. I guess I just wanted structure images for now.
- Also, Eden doesn't have a forum, right? I think... And as far as the extra residences go I am going to look into side by siding those two to reduce on used vertical space. Maybe...
WIKI LINK-OPUniverse Wiki (https://wiki.outpost2.net/doku.php?id=start)
UPDATE - Online manual start page done
- Tutorials page done
- Buildings and structures page done
- Vehicles page done
- Tech tree pages added and done
- Rules pages done
- Interface guide added
- Spaceport and starship components added
- Detailed unit descriptions page added and done ( 2015-11-29 )
ITEMS that need adjusting/correcting still
- MHD generator pic
- Adjust light tower sizes (get new images)
- Mines for both colonies DONE
- Pics for Weapons and Weapon Turrets
- Need to add Starship Components - Started
- The attack chassis section of the wiki is unreadable on mobile. Going to need help with that. DONE
- Maybe add a page for Detailed Unit Descriptions? DONE and Completed
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As soon as someone gets around to reading this...
- The new wiki should be complete enough that with in the week whom ever is in charge of the wiki (probably Leeor, best guess) could change the link at the top of the OPU home page over to the new Wiki page.
- Yes of course who ever is in charge of the site or wiki or whatever (who ever is the oldest) can decide when to swap it over.
- Thanks Leeor and Hooman for the help. I have a list of items that I have done that need polishing, and I will update those when possible.
- Somebody else may need to fill in all aspects for the Original Outpost game. Never played it and don't know my way around it... like at all.
David R.V.
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The OP2Graphics (https://forum.outpost2.net/index.php/topic,1593.msg31767.html#msg31767) project may already do what you want. It should let you get images of buildings without the idle/disabled/active light. The attached zip file contains an executable file as well as the Visual Basic source code.
Feel free to suggest improvements for the project to make what you're doing easier.
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There is apparently still some contention amongst some of the moderators so I don't know if they will necessarily link to the wiki hosted on the outpostuniverse.org domain but maybe they would consider moving wiki.outpost2.net to oldwiki.outpost2.net and importing the DokuWiki setup we've been working into wiki.outpost2.net. I'm happy with whatever. We should also be able to use the DokuWiki install as the main page as BlackBox once suggested a few years ago. It's well suited to that task I think.
Anyway, nice work with the Outpost 2 section! Fleshes that whole bit out.
I'll probably do the Outpost 1 work myself as it's kind of my game and I've been obsessed with it since 1994 (holy shit, for 21 flipping years).
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Contention amongst moderators eh? Well that's good...
Can I ask what over or would that be 'stirring the pot' so to speak? Oh well, as long as my work (it's work I guess, hell with it, that's what i'm calling it) on the new wiki wasn't for waste then it don't matter to me what the argument is I suppose.
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I would like to work on transferring the Novellas to the Doku Wiki. I have a Doku Wiki account as username Vagabond if someone doesn't mind giving me write permissions. I've worked with Creole and Markdown syntax before, so it shouldn't be too difficult for me to work Doku syntax.
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Leviathan, are you the only one who can set write permission?
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Nope, I'm also an admin on the Wiki. I had to update some permissions to control spam so I'll go ahead and get write permissions updated here in a few minutes. Next time you log on you should be able to create and edit new articles.
Can I ask what over or would that be 'stirring the pot' so to speak?
It's old news and really kind of irrelevant today so I'll just leave it in the past. Suffice it to say if we wanted to integrate the dokuwiki with the current Outpost2.net domain we'd need to actually move the installation to the Outpost2.net servers. It's definitely doable but I think only after the outpost2.net servers have been upgraded to prevent more outages in the future like we've been experiencing.
EDIT:
Permissions have been updated.
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Yeah that's fine, no need to aggravate people.
Oh, and Hooman will notice that I went ahead and changed all my dates over to the ISO style... didn't want his head to explode.
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Yeah! And there was much rejoicing. Finally, I will be able to read dates without confusion. No more will I find myself hoping all date stamps are past the 12th of the month, just to be sure I was reading them correctly.
Rest of the world, take note!
Also, good to know there isn't a one person bottleneck for setting up new accounts.
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I've started work on the wiki and have been uploading chapters. You can see the main page here: http://wiki.outpost2.net/doku.php?id=outpost_2:storyline.
I followed Dave's example on the footnote links to maintain consistency. I'm trying to place all the pages in useful namespaces to keep organization proper. Only 3 more chapters for Plymouth remain. I'll have to play through Eden to get some of their chapters out of the game unless someone knows how to easily extract them.
I cannot figure out how to center a line of text in the Doku Wiki syntax. J. Steven York likes to use centered # # # in the novellas. I have tried using the html tag center (deprecated in HTML 4) and the text-align css property without success. If someone has some insight on this, it would be appreciated.
I'm trying to stay faithful to the text by copying over the italics part of the text and other formatting, but I may miss a couple since I'm skimming the text.
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Nice. Vagabond got the novellas in, and thanks for following what I've already done, whether it's right or not I don't know.
On that subject I'm not entirely sure I got the namespaces concept right or not. If I don't then let me know and I'll fix it.
As far as the paragraph breaks go by using # # # I haven't seen anything in syntax or plugins that would work. Other than a one line table or column, or using a aligned image might work.
Good stuff man.
Dave
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I'll have to play through Eden to get some of their chapters out of the game unless someone knows how to easily extract them.
The novellas are stored as RTF files in story.vol. You can open that using the VolExtractor (https://outpost2.net/files/coding/VOLExtractor.exe) tool.
Alternatively, launch Outpost 2. At the main menu, type D on your keyboard to access the debug menu. Select "Coming Back", enter 12 into the "Last Mission Completed" box, and click the Eden checkbox. Then click OK. You'll now have all novella chapters available in the Story menu.
Don't try launching Eden Mission #13, though. :P
Now, how do I get edit access to this thing?
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I would like to add a Legacy Section to the Wiki.
- a one or two page area that has any data on the old wiki not relevant to playing games or building maps, (there was a page showing all of the old clans on sigs/won for example) figured somebody might be sentimental about that and want it kept around. This way its there but out of the way I guess. Or if not that, something different or not at all. Suggestions?
And a section for Games and Maps Archive. Not everybody has access to the SVN or wants it I would guess, and any user submitted maps, colony games, multiplayer etc could be put here and downloaded. Also how do you add items to download off the wiki if that's possible? Or should it just be a link back to the OPU thread it originated from? Make finding new maps and games to play easier.
I only ask because I just stumbled upon Angellus's colony game, which I died in the first fifteen minutes from an unreasonably large quake... I will have to revisit that game. Also, cool new tech tree, has it been updated since? I have suggestions, constructive, I'm not being an asshat.
Thoughts?
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Sirbomber,
Thanks for the tips. The debug mode worked great to pull the rest of the novella chapters.
When I tried using the VolExtractor, it game me this error when running:
VOLEdit
Component 'COMDLG32.OCX' or one of its dependencies not correctly registered: a file is missing or invalid.
I tried running it after placing it inside the Outpost 2 folder on my CPU that contains the game executable. Am I missing a file or supposed to place it somewhere else?
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COMDLG32.OCX is an old Windows system file, and I'm guessing it's outdated/obsolete if you don't have it on your system.
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You can probably download COMDLG32.OCX from Microsoft, and then manually register it with regsrv32. A similar problem, and solution, was posted about for the OP2Graphics (https://forum.outpost2.net/index.php/topic,1593.msg31767.html#msg31767) viewer recently. It may very well be a problem with a lot of old projects now.
Very clever with the debug menu there Sirbomber.
As for SVN, it's for working on and distributing source code, not compiled binary packages, but it is publicly readable, so technically everyone has access to it. Just not everyone wants to use it. :P I'd say link to a forum thread for download. You'd want one authoritative place to find a download. Plus, there is the issue of ownership. Potentially anyone could replace a binary package on the wiki, but downloads on the forums are very clearly tied to a particular user.
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I know it's not a perfect solution but you can use the horizontal rule '----' in place of # # #.
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Work on the Outpost 2 storyline part of the wiki has gone well. I've inserted some of the mission briefings and am loading all the mission briefing graphics that I think Dave uploaded. Still more work to go, but you can see the progress here: https://wiki.outpost2.net/doku.php?id=outpost_2:storyline.
Does anyone know where I can find a copy of the original in game help manual (and if any special requirements are required to view)? It doesn't seem to be in version 1.3.5 of the game from our website. I'd like to review the contents of it. I could probably pull from the original CD but I don't have access to my copy in the short term.
Next steps are to finalize novella chapters, finish uploading briefings, and upload all the Tales From New Terra.
@Leeor_Net:
I'm learning that while Doku Wiki supports html input, it has to be activated on the site's configuration page. This probably explains why the HTML I was inputting didn't work, since I doubt it is enabled. I don't think there is necessarily a problem with enabling html as long as we are vetting contributors. We would be vulnerable to things like cross-site scripting attacks and maybe some other nefarious acts if anyone with edit permissions wanted to be malicious.
I could also use a plugin like the one here: https://www.dokuwiki.org/plugin:divalign2 that would allow centering without enabling HTML. This would require an admin installing it though.
I think for the short term, I'm just going to leave the # # # marker in the chapters left aligned. It is still a clear separator and will paste into a rich text editor nicer than if we put in the the horizontal rules throughout the chapters. If someone enables HTML or pushes the plugin, let me know and I'll fix, but I understand if neither is implemented.
@Hooman
If I manage to fix the VolExtractor, I'll make sure to post what I do in an appropriate place. Not sure how much I want to pull this string though...
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I vaguely remember someone stripped the help manual from the download way back in the day to cut down on its size. Off the top of my head, the SVN repository has a complete CD install checked in under the GameDownload/tags folder. You can most likely find the help file in there. It's publicly readable, so you don't need an account to get the file.
Come to think of it, you can likely grab individual files using just a web browser. And there it is, Outpost2.hlp (https://svn.outpostuniverse.org:8443/!/#outpost2/view/head/GameDownload/Outpost2/tags/Outpost2-1.2.0.5-Sierra-CD-Install/Outpost2.hlp).
You may see a certificate security warning. Access is through SSL, but without a proper certificate. If you click on advanced, you can ignore the warning and still visit the page to download the file. It would be nice to get that sorted some day.
What specifically is wrong with VolExtractor?
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it has to be activated on the site's configuration page
Yup... it does. I thought i had set it but checking configuration and definitely wasn't set. Keep HTML to a minimum though only because you know how amazingly well these things can be abused.
I could also use a plugin like the one here
I looked into that plugin but it's tagged as experimental and so far my experience with plugins marked like that has been less than stellar.
We do have the Columns plugin installed however which may do the same sort of thing: https://www.dokuwiki.org/plugin:columns
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@Leeor_Net
Thanks for looking into it! Good call on minimizing the HTML used. I'll keep it simple and try and use the plugins first. Only problem is, I don't know how to review what plugins have been installed. I don't see a way to access a list of installed plugins, but if there is please let me know. Perhaps we could setup a quick admin page that lists installed plugins and any other info/guidelines on editing pages from an admin perspective. I'm not sure if Doku Wiki supports it, but making the page invisible to users who are not signed in with privileges would be a good call if it lists some info on the guts of our wiki.
@hooman,
Thanks for the tips on the help file! I had to do some fiddling since Windows 7 doesn't support help files out of the box anymore. Downloading it from the SVN repository was no problem. I believe Windows Vista and newer Microsoft operating systems would require the steps below, but I only tested on Windows 7:
Download the required program to open the help file from here: https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/kb/917607
If you download the file from an internet site, you have to ensure it is "unblocked". To do this, right click on the file from within My Computer and select properties. Then click UNBLOCK in the bottom right of the dialog. (The error message I received when the file was "blocked" wanted me to try reopening the file after copying to a different computer drive, which wasn't intuitive.)
I'll get back to you on the VolExtractor when I have more time.
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Thank you for the note and the link about the help files.
At first I thought the link was bad when I clicked it, since the page title started with "Error opening ...". Turned out to be "Error opening Help", and mentioned a "Help not supported" error message.
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Hey everyone,
I know it has been a while, but I've been plugging away at the new Wiki. I remade the main page to be more than a simple index: https://wiki.outpost2.net/doku.php?id=start (https://wiki.outpost2.net/doku.php?id=start).
I'm considering the storyline section for Outpost 2 completed. If anyone notices anything is missing or out of place, please let me know. It can be found here: https://wiki.outpost2.net/doku.php?id=outpost_2:storyline (https://wiki.outpost2.net/doku.php?id=outpost_2:storyline). Hopefully it makes the story more accessible without having to load the game up.
I've added the storyline from Outpost 1's manual to the Outpost 1 section.
The entire Outpost 2 research tree is now posted at: https://wiki.outpost2.net/doku.php?id=outpost_2:outpost_2_manual:reasearch (https://wiki.outpost2.net/doku.php?id=outpost_2:outpost_2_manual:reasearch). It includes new technology from the Multi-Tek files.
I'm planning to work on the Outpost 2 maps/mapmaking section next unless Dave-O is going to continue work on it in the short term. Also need to get back to Hooman on the VolExtractor at some point.
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What your doing looks great man, keep it up.
As far as the first Outpost game is concerned you can probably leave the rest to Leeor. I'm sure once he is fully functional he was going to take over doing that section of the wiki.
For the rest, the sections I filled in I will probably return to sometime in the next few weeks as there are some areas I need to address and complete (probably spend this week on chapters 5&6 of my little thing I'm writing) and then I'll get back to that.
Good job.
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Hmm, very nice.
What is it about the VolExtractor (https://forum.outpost2.net/index.php/topic,1834.msg34280.html#msg34280) you need my help with? (I can help, but to be clear, I didn't write it).
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I have been spending more time on the older wiki, and it contains a large amount of info on programming Outpost 2. I can see why we don't want to remove it yet. This info will be difficult to move over to the new wiki without someone who has some knowledge of how it works. It would help if information was more organized on the older Wiki. Right now I resort to just clicking on random links from the all articles page.
@Hooman,
By my comment, I meant to follow up with your suggestion on how to fix the Vol Extrator:
You can probably download COMDLG32.OCX from Microsoft, and then manually register it with regsrv32. A similar problem, and solution, was posted about for the OP2Graphics viewer recently. It may very well be a problem with a lot of old projects now.
Downloading the file and registering as you suggested worked, so the Vol Extractor is now working. Thank you. I'll post a comment on the VolExractor forum page soon with a little more detail.
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Downloading the file and registering as you suggested worked, so the Vol Extractor is now working. Thank you. I'll post a comment on the VolExractor forum page soon with a little more detail.
Thank you for taking care of this.
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Hey guys, great work on the Wiki so far!
I've been lagging behind in getting Outpost 1 fleshed out but I'm getting there!
As for mapping and programming, the old wiki has a lot of information of Outpost2 programming but it's very much all over the place. We talked a bit about how to handle it and ultimately we want an Outpost 2 programming section thats' well laid out with tutorials and examples without just little snippets of semi-useful code. Also, a lot of the information on the old Wiki is out of date or no longer relevant or just plain wrong so a direct port to the new wiki is probably not the way to handle it.
As for mapping itself, I have no experience with the mapper tools so whoever does have experience, write away. You've done great work so far with little oversight and things are looking great so keep it up!
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You've done great work so far with little oversight and things are looking great so keep it up!
Yes, that little oversight part is what impresses me the most.
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Damn Vaga, you've done as much or more than me now.
Nice.
Isn't there a way to get the table of contents to ride down beside the page rather than force most of the page to start from the bottom of the index? (Yes I know you can hide it, or just write one line in the page code to get rid of the table but that would suck)
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Thanks everyone for the attaboys.
@Dave,
I'm assuming you are looking at the research page for the long index. I could disable the default and build an index by hand. I think the other option is just fill in more text in the intro so there is less dead space.
I've uploaded a couple of images incorrectly that need deleted and misspelled a page's namespace name. Is there any way to delete content and change page names, or does that require an admin? If it takes and admin, I will just list out the changes for someone to make.
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So I started getting the Outpost manual typed up and added to the Wiki... and am realizing how long winded the developers were about EVERYTHING. SO MUCH WRITTEN but SO LITTLE SAID. It's astonishing, really.
The 'Official Strategy Guide' is the same way. The hubris is breathtaking. It's evident that the developers (and designer in particular) thought that they had created the most amazing software product ever. Wonder if it came as a surprise when the backlash started.
So this is a project that will take some time. But I'll be working on it here and there and get it all up there.
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I'm working on the new wiki's map page, and am trying to associate the DLL file and .map file to the pictures of each map. I remember seeing Leviathan posting a list somewhere in the forums but I can't seem to find it now that I would like to reference it. Does anyone know where it is or an alternate source, besides Manually pulling each map and reviewing it?
For example:
Biohazard
mp3_02.map
DLL (space race): mf3_02.dll
I have pictures of almost all the maps uploaded and associated to their map names, so the page should be really helpful if someone wants to find the name of that sweet map they played long ago. The page's format still needs some ironing out though.
If you want to review progress so far: https://wiki.outpost2.net/doku.php?id=outpost_2:maps
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Hmm, nice.
I'm not aware of any list, but it'd be possible to write a tool to help with it. The game identifies levels by DLLs. Scan for DLLs, read the level description exports to get the map name and description. You now have the DLL name and map name tied together. You could also probably use the map editor backend to produce an image of the minimap. That would be a generic enough tool. You could extend all this by automatically uploading the information to the wiki, or somehow displaying it on the website.
You've got me thinking now.
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@Hooman,
I managed to find the list from Leviathan here: https://www.outpost2.net/oldwiki/Map_List.
I've manually hand jammed all the map filenames, scenario DLLs, etc. The mapper program, like you suggested, worked great to pull images of the maps. They are all uploaded after I converted them to JPG so they are smaller than bmps. This has taken a fair amount of work, but is done.
There are still some holes in the data, like I'm having difficulty finding the 3rd Plymouth and 3rd Eden mission in the map data for some reason.
Also, I cannot get the multiplayer map punwick junction to load. I am only trying to play 2 player though, so maybe it requires 4 players to work properly?
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One thing I want to point out that irritates the PISS out of me -- the thumbnail maps. Would love if clicking on them provided a larger version that can be viewed in higher resolution. It doesn't need to be full resolution (though that would be nice) but SOMETHING larger.
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I'm not aware of any list, but it'd be possible to write a tool to help with it.
Here. (https://outpost2.net/files/MissionScanner.zip)
Also, I cannot get the multiplayer map punwick junction to load. I am only trying to play 2 player though, so maybe it requires 4 players to work properly?
You're probably missing opu_03.map. No great loss, don't worry. I believe the map was just a copy (maybe slightly modified, but barely enough to matter) of La Corrida, so if you really want to run the game, make a copy of on4_01.map and rename it opu_03.map. Running the game real quick, it looks like a copy of La Corrida (same base setup) but with the AI removed and with a mining beacon located right next to your Smelter to get your economy going faster. However, I also seem to recall this map earning the nickname "Punf**k Junction" and being universally hated, so it's likely that it has some annoying quirk or feature that I didn't play long enough to experience. That or my memory is bad. :P
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Yes, I was totally thinking something similar. Imagine Google maps for Outpost 2 worlds. :D
Actually, I think there are special JavaScript libraries for tile based maps. Makes sense, since so many games are tile based. Someone had to write it.
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Does anyone know where opu_03.map is hidden in the OP2 folder? I looked thru all the .vol files and found nothing.
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It's gone. It doesn't exist anymore. If someone has a really old install (1.3.3 maybe) on a hard drive somewhere, or if you feel like dumpster diving through ancient forum posts, you might be able to find it, but it's probably not worth the effort.
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Then where does the La Corrida map come from? Or is it labeled differently?
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Dave,
La Corrida is DLL ml4_21.dll with Map on4_01.map. The MissionScanner that SirBomber posted makes this really easy to figure out!
SirBomber,
Mission Scanner worked perfectly! Did you program the mission scanner, or was it developed by someone else? I didn't see any documentation on the forum about it. Your tips on Punwick Junction worked as well. I plagiarized your instructions on how to get it to work and put it under the map page, in case anyone else is interested.
leeor_net,
I wouldn't mind seeing the maps in higher resolution, but what I uploaded was the version the mapper exports. If someone knows a way to export them in a higher resolution that isn't much more difficult than using the built in mapper function, then I wouldn't mind putting the time in to convert them and post them. The good news is all maps are relatively the same size, so you can tell by looking what the relative size difference is between maps.
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I didn't make it, nor do I know who did.
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on4_01.map found it.
The hell did I miss that? Thank you.
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I think BlackBox made the mission scanner, but I'm not completely certain.
It should be possible to make a utility that can draw a map to a great big image file. It'd be huge file though. You can always scale it down to something reasonable though, or perhaps scale down the tilesets, and then draw, so you never have to deal with an image that's too large.
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Just had a question for the structure of the wiki. We currently have an API/SDK section and a mapmaking section. What is the separation between these two sections? I thought the SDK was designed to allow making new maps.
Just taking a stab at how this should be setup, but probably fold mapmaking into the SDK section.
SDK Overview
* Setting up Visual Studio and compiling a basic DLL
* Overview of available helper programs like the MissionScanner, SheetsReader, MapMaker
* How to use the mapmaker to construct new maps
* How to use the mapmaker to construct new tilesets
* How to program a scenario DLL
* The inner workings of Outpost 2 as we know it
* Repository Overview and best practices
* Redmine Overview and best practices
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I'd label the section "Map Making" rather than "SDK Overview". The term "SDK" won't mean much to people that aren't already familiar with the term, but "Map Making" should be clear.
Some people specialize their time with designing maps, but not full missions. They'd learn to use the map editor, but not how to code missions for the maps. Their maps can be handed off to other people to write DLLs for a mission. And of course some people write new missions, but can't be bothered to design a new map. It might be good to organize the structure to support such differences. You're probably right about combining things into one overview section though.
It would be really nice to have an overview describing and linking to all the tools, and include a description of a typical workflow.
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I put some more time into the wiki. I'm not happy with the content on the SDK page yet and what I have written is incomplete. It will also eventually need to be merged/moved into the mapmaking section that Dave started as Hooman pointed out. I'm going to spend some time making a colony map to learn more about the SDK before I write much more on the Wiki. Sir Bomber's map tutorials are excellent.
Once we start writing in earnest on the SDK, I would like to see labels on each page for which version of the SDK it has last been validated for. Hopefully that will keep data relevant longer and make it easy for new users to spot outdated info.
Below is a list of mistakes I've made on the wiki. They need cleaned up by someone who can delete or rename files since I can apparently only create content, but not destroy pages themselves or rename them.
* Delete the namespace outpost_2 out of outpost_2 (outpost_2:outpost_2). I somehow accidentally created it.
* Delete the PNG at outpost_1:cda14605-1f25-488d-9bb7-8f3cff3d42aa.png.
* Swap the name of the 2 files outpost_2:maps:the_rift.jpg and outpost_2:maps:root_canal.jpg. I mislabeled the maps. Once the names are swapped, they will appear correctly on the maps page since they are currently showing incorrectly.
* Rename the page outpost_2:outpost_2_manual:reasearch to research. (This will break links to the page. The following 3 pages link to research right now. I can fix once the name of the page is fixed. https://wiki.outpost2.net/doku.php?id=outpost_2:outpost_2, https://wiki.outpost2.net/doku.php?id=outpost_2:storyline, https://wiki.outpost2.net/doku.php?id=outpost_2:outpost_2_manual:online_manual)
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Thank you for working on this.
Just a quick note: BlackBox = op2hacker
I noticed both aliases are used on the sdk:helper_programs page for the authors of various tools. BlackBox is his current alias.
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Below is a list of mistakes I've made on the wiki. They need cleaned up by someone who can delete or rename files since I can apparently only create content, but not destroy pages themselves or rename them.
* Delete the namespace outpost_2 out of outpost_2 (outpost_2:outpost_2). I somehow accidentally created it.
* Delete the PNG at outpost_1:cda14605-1f25-488d-9bb7-8f3cff3d42aa.png.
* Swap the name of the 2 files outpost_2:maps:the_rift.jpg and outpost_2:maps:root_canal.jpg. I mislabeled the maps. Once the names are swapped, they will appear correctly on the maps page since they are currently showing incorrectly.
* Rename the page outpost_2:outpost_2_manual:reasearch to research. (This will break links to the page. The following 3 pages link to research right now. I can fix once the name of the page is fixed. https://wiki.outpost2.net/doku.php?id=outpost_2:outpost_2, https://wiki.outpost2.net/doku.php?id=outpost_2:storyline, https://wiki.outpost2.net/doku.php?id=outpost_2:outpost_2_manual:online_manual)
Have implemented this as of today.
Now that I have direct access to the filesystem involved in the wiki installation I can readily make corrections like this so let me know if there are any other mistakes that need to be cleared.
Also if there are any plugins that you think would be a good additional let me know and I'll get them installed.
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Leeor_net,
Thank you for fixing these issues! I think the updated theme looks great!
Is there a way to change the browser icon to the Outpost Universe symbol as opposed to the doku wiki icon? (The icon next to the title page on the tab at the top of the browser or that displays next to the link on the favorites menu.)
I have been pretty happy with the current customizations that I can make without any additional plugins.
-Brett
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I knew I was forgetting something.
Yes, it's called a favicon, just need to drop one into the directory. Should have that up and ready in a short bit.
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Looking good.
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Hey everyone,
I've been putting more time into the wiki. In particular, polishing the Outpost 2 SDK (mapmaking) section. Some of the topics were a little disorganzied and scattered, so I attempted to unify everything and place all the content into sections that make intuitive sense. If anyone reviews, please let me know if anything is missed or wrong. https://wiki.outpost2.net/doku.php?id=op2_sdk:software_development_kit_sdk.
The only real new content in the SDK is how to open multiple instances of Outpost 2 for debugging multiplayer scenarios. It came in handy when working on Outpost Monopoly and thought I would share. https://wiki.outpost2.net/doku.php?id=op2_sdk:debugging_scenarios
The next task I would like to cover on the SDK is editing tile sets, but I don't have the experience to write about it yet. The wiki only covers a smattering of the Outpost 2 C++ API. I wouldn't mind rounding this section out, but what I've written so far is scattered and disorganized. Sirbomber's tutorials are already pretty good and can teach people much of what they need anyways. The wiki section on Mapmaking needs to be fleshed out as well.
Outpost 2 Maps Section
As discussed some with Leoor on a separate post, I would like to cut the Outpost 2 maps section in separate pages for Campaign, Colony Games, Multiplayer, Custom (not included in Outpost 2 download), and maybe a misc section (for things like the demo & tutorial maps). I think the Outpost 2 maps page has grown too large and there are more maps to still add. If anyone has preferences for how this all works and looks please let me know. Right now I plan to stick to grouping all scenarios that use the same map underneath that map. Unless the map has both single and muliplayer scenarios associated and I guess then the map would have to be listed on both pages. This makes sense to me so the wiki isn't drawing the same map for each entry of a scenario that uses it. https://wiki.outpost2.net/doku.php?id=outpost_2:maps
Outpost 2 Technical Review
I added a section on Outpost 2 technical review. This is supposed to be for writing out about how the game can be or has been edited beyond making new maps and scenarios. Things like editing the videos, music, VOL files, .HLP file, etc. It is mostly just stubs right now. https://wiki.outpost2.net/doku.php?id=outpost_2:technical_review
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Looks really good -- I can see where some of the information needs to be fleshed out but I think you have considerably more experience with it than I do. Sirbomber's input would be helpful I think but as I understand he's using a highly modified version of the SDK or something like that.
I think your possibility for the maps section works -- I would just break the different types into their own pages and cross-reference them from the main maps page.
Technical review is a good idea, not sure I'd call it that specifically. I don't have a better suggestion so it should be fine for now.
Great work!
I still need to finish the research and OP1 online versions of the manual... :-\
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I finished up reformating the Outpost 2 Maps page. See the post here for details: https://forum.outpost2.net/index.php/topic,5903.msg84083/topicseen.html.
I also finished up a section on Outpost 2 Easter Eggs! You can check it out here: https://wiki.outpost2.net/doku.php?id=outpost_2:easter_eggs.
Fixing 2 Wiki Mistakes:
Leeor, would you mind going in and deleting the media namespace outpost_2:easter_egg and the file scat.gif from the Wiki? I accidentally uploaded it there when I meant outpost_2:easter_eggs in instead. The GIF is included and referenced from the proper namespace, so deleting the non-plural namespace will not cause any issues with the wiki.
Also, could you move the page maps:eden_campaign_maps to outpost_2:maps:eden_campaign_maps. This will cause a broken link on the main maps page, but I can go back and fix that once the page is moved. I forgot the Outpost_2 namespace prefix when creating the page.
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These two issues appear to already be corrected.
Easiest way to 'delete' a page is to simply delete all the contents of the page and then save. DokuWiki will purge it from the cache after a few minutes.
I don't see the scat.gif file or the easter_egg namespace you mentioned so I'll assume same thing, DokuWiki already purged empty files.
Also, I updated the start page to use visual links instead of just the text links... hopefully it works well for navigation.
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The wiki link for downloading the mapper or other tools (it links to outpost2.net/dltools.php) appears to be inoperative.
Was going to re-download the OP2Mapper as the version I had on my computer has disappeared or something...
EDIT=> Found my copy, this still needs looking into
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Dave,
I fixed the download links on the Outpost 2 Helper page. I didn't realize anyone used that page. The original links used the Outpost 2 web page that had the tools. This page was never re-added after the website update. The wiki now links directly to the files themselves as opposed to the dead page.
Leeor,
I think the icons are an improvement. Thank you for adding them. There are a lot under Outpost 2 (10 total). Maybe we should look at reducing the number of main topics, not sure? I think the icons might look better if they are a little smaller. It would be really cool if someone artistic redesigned them to look more Outpost themed. :)
Thanks for the tip on deleting pages. This worked great and I moved the Eden Maps page into the proper namespace. Here is a direct link to the SCAT gif I want deleted: http://wiki.outpost2.net/doku.php?image=outpost_2%3Aeaster_egg%3Ascat.gif&ns=outpost_2%3Aeaster_egg&tab_details=view&do=media&tab_files=files (Note, this link will probably not work if someone does not have a user account in the wiki).
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I think the icons are an improvement. Thank you for adding them. There are a lot under Outpost 2 (10 total). Maybe we should look at reducing the number of main topics, not sure?
Not sure we really need to reduce the count... actually I already did from the original list that was in place. But I'm certainly open to suggestions.
I think the icons might look better if they are a little smaller. It would be really cool if someone artistic redesigned them to look more Outpost themed. :)
Smaller I can agree with. They do resize dynamically based on the size of the window in which they're opened. I opted for big so that it would be difficult to miss them or mistake what they are.
As for new art -- I'm also totally game. These all came from a couple of free icon packs that generally represented what I was looking for. I'm no artist though...
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I'm still poking through the Wiki and making occasional updates.
I finally managed to get Greenworld to work with the Outpost 2 mapper. Unfortunately, it seemed to take poor minimap pictures of Greenworld maps. Intead, loading the maps from within Outpost 2 and using in game minimap screen shots seemed to produce better results. All the Greenworld maps I'm aware of including McShay's bridgework is in the maps section now with pictures.
I found the scenario Battle of the Blight (by onehand) and added it as well. Very interesting concept and seems playable. Haven't had the opportunity to actually play it multiplayer though. Somehow I missed Sirbomber’s scenario Judgement Day. Once I get it added and look into the multitek sandbox scenarios, I think everything will be up to date in the custom scenarios section.
Outpost 2 Mission Coding
I've made some minor improvements to Outpost 2 SDK pages. The SDK documentation as a whole is still disorganized and incomplete. A couple of sections like creating the initial Visual Studio Project and adding a modal dialog box for mission briefings are well done, but much of the bulk of documenting the SDK is unwritten.
Leeor or someone with admin rights:
When we updated the wiki theme to match the rest of the Outpost 2 site, the syntax highlighting for source code was not updated. Due to the dark background, some code had become very hard to read due to its color being too close to the background. Some of the syntax should be switched to lighter colors. See this page and CTRL+F the word NULL to see what I mean: http://wiki.outpost2.net/doku.php?id=op2_sdk:textdialogbox.
Some of the affected reserved words/symbols are: enum, null, &, true, +, -, and class.
Pulling from another post into this one: http://forum.outpost2.net/index.php/topic,5804.msg84299.html#msg84299
In the mean time, do you think you'd have time to put together usage samples on the Wiki? One of the goals for the wiki is to provide tutorials and coding examples and such and this and the other things you've worked on I think are prime things to work with for setting up a development section.
Leeor & Sirbomber,
I think Sirbomber's tutorials on the forum are a pretty good way to work through the inns and outs of how to program the guts of the scenario. If I were to add more tutorials to the wiki, it would probably be copying fairly large chunks of this, which I don't mind working on. I do like the idea of getting this code into the wiki and nicely indexed as opposed to sifting through the forum post. Not sure how Sirbomber feels about all this or it is something he would want to work on since he has already put a lot of time into the forum tutorials?
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Leeor or someone with admin rights:
When we updated the wiki theme to match the rest of the Outpost 2 site, the syntax highlighting for source code was not updated. Due to the dark background, some code had become very hard to read due to its color being too close to the background. Some of the syntax should be switched to lighter colors. See this page and CTRL+F the word NULL to see what I mean: http://wiki.outpost2.net/doku.php?id=op2_sdk:textdialogbox.
I've adjusted the background color -- seems to work a lot better. I can dig into the source code if need be.
On that note -- you've done a lot of work with the Wiki and I could use some assistance with its administration -- if you're up for it I can add you to the admin group. Let me know.
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Leeor, thanks for the adjustment. It looks like the color scheme works well now.
I would be happy to help some with the admin of the wiki.
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Done. You should now have backend access, let me know if there are any problems.
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I just finished a second pass on Outpost 2 helper programs in the Wiki. Basically, each program has its own page now, that is linked from the helper programs index. http://wiki.outpost2.net/doku.php?id=outpost_2:helper_programs
I wanted to give OP2MapImager its own page, so went ahead and gave each helper program a separate page. If any of the original authors want to play with their pages at all it would be encouraged, but since the tools were made so long ago, I don't think it will happen.
Next up, I'm going to revamp the maps/scenarios section with new renderings using the OP2MapImager. It may take some time to get everything uploaded and linked.
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Nice. I've been meaning to do that myself... seems I tend to drag things out more than I realized.
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Next up, I'm going to revamp the maps/scenarios section with new renderings using the OP2MapImager. It may take some time to get everything uploaded and linked.
This can be automated too.
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Just finished updating all the maps. The maps shown inline are all scale of 1 pixel per tile. When you click on the image it will bring up a scale 6 pixel per tile image. I picked 6, because the largest map images would come in at about 3.5-3.8 megabytes, which is below the 5 mb wiki upload limit. It also seemed like a good balance on the amount of data to upload to the wiki as it was about 90 megabytes total. The smaller maps could easily be scaled up even more, but I kept everything consistent. Comments or improvements are welcome.
http://wiki.outpost2.net/doku.php?id=outpost_2:maps
I cleaned up some inconsistencies in some of the links in the OP2 Storyline section and fixed some incorrect data in the maps section as well.
This can be automated too.
I'm finished with the maps for now, so feel free to jump in and start automating. Just teach us how to use it as well.
Wiki Main Page
I think the wiki would benefit a lot from redesigning the landing page. It is currently a listing starting with Outpost 1 of the larger Wiki settings. It would be nicer if we could throw up a nice image(s). The left image could be some nice Outpost 1 artwork and the right image an Outpost 2 artwork. Then the artwork could be overlayed with the words "Enter Outpost 1" or "Enter Outpost 2". Maybe a banner at the top that had Outpost Universe logo and was clickable to goto any Outpost Universe Specific content. Then we would need to design separate landing pages for Outpost 1, Outpost 2, and Outpost Universe. (Outpost Universe could be omitted as there isn't a lot of content there anyways)
I could probably create a passable set of graphics for a landing page to start with, but I'm sure others could do a lot better than me.
(http://forum.outpost2.net/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=5721.0;attach=860;image)
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Being able to see the higher resolution maps makes a HUGE world of diffeence, nice work!
As for the redesigned landing page, I'm game. I have some thoughts on how to do it and I like your overall idea. Only think I would change about it is adding a third section across the bottom for OPU community stuff like projects and anything else that would make sense there.
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Leeor,
I'm happy if either the banner at the top links to OPU landing page or second banner at the bottom links or whatever other variation.
We currently have sort of Wikipedia style overviews of each game as their 'landing pages'.
* http://wiki.outpost2.net/doku.php?id=outpost_1:outpost
* http://wiki.outpost2.net/doku.php?id=outpost_2:outpost_2
I was thinking maybe move these to a page called Overview, Summary or something similar.
Then the landing page can be more of a Table of Contents for that section of the wiki with a prominent link to the game's overview page. Maybe a short blurb at the top introducing the game that has the larger summary page as a link.
I think there is a balance between telling a new person what the game is about and making the Wiki index visible and easy to navigate through. IE not making a longtime user always scroll through 2 pages of intro text just to get to the maps or storyline section. I was experimenting some on this on the Outpost 2 landing page. I guess the hard part is probably getting that balance correct.
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... I was thinking maybe move these to a page called Overview, Summary or something similar.
Makes sense to me. Page renames are pretty straight forward.
I think there is a balance between telling a new person what the game is about and making the Wiki index visible and easy to navigate through. IE not making a longtime user always scroll through 2 pages of intro text just to get to the maps or storyline section. I was experimenting some on this on the Outpost 2 landing page. I guess the hard part is probably getting that balance correct.
That's the hard part. I'm not really sure how to go about this -- my mind isn't in it today but I'll take a look at it over the course of the week. Seems you started some work on the Outpost 2 version, I'll work on the OP1 section then.
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That does look pretty good now. The combo of low resolution and high resolution maps is really nice.
No sense automating any of the map image and info uploading if you're already done.